By Bruce A. Smith
DB Cooper is back in the news this evening as a local Seattle NBC report on the metals found on his tie is going nationwide. A special investigation by KING 5 TV reporter Chris Ingalls has been pricked up by other news organizations, such as USA Today, and is being reprinted and rebroadcast. Most tellingly, I just got a call from my mother in New York City that she saw a clip on it during the evening news.
In his piece Ingalls interviews Tom Kaye, the head of a private group of scientists recruited by the FBI in 2009, known as the Citizens Sleuths, to study the DB Cooper evidence in depth. Kaye discussed the recent findings that nearly 100,000 particles, including rare earth metals such as Yttrium and Strontium, have been found on the tie DB Cooper left behind on his plane during his famous hijacking event 45 years ago.
It is the only unsolved skyjacking case in the history of the United States, and the FBI officially closed the case last July amidst great controversy, citing a lack of substantive evidence and a dearth of suspects. Now, the case seems to be re-ignited, although the FBI has yet to comment on this most recent findings nor has it officially re-opened its investigation.
The 100,000 particles were discovered recently by the world renown research firm, McCrone Labs, who had been expanding upon the earlier research conducted by the Citizen Sleuths. According to Kaye, McCrone used “fully automated scanning electron microscopes to find, photograph and then analyze over 100,000 particles from 20 different stubs.”
Prior, the Citizen Sleuths had only been able to examine 800 particles that the team had looked at manually. Initially, in 2009 and 2010 the Citizen Sleuth had taken “sticky tape” samples from the tie and examined them under their own electron microscopes and other conducted other metallurgic and chemical tests. Surprisingly, they discovered shards of pure titanium, bismuth, and other exotic metals. These findings led researchers to explore the possibility that DB Cooper had worked in an advanced metallurgic foundry, such as Oremet in Albany, Oregon, or was a lab technician.
One independent Cooper sleuth, Bob Sailshaw, who is a former Boeing engineer, postulated that DB Cooper might have been prime suspect Sheridan Peterson. Peterson, featured in the 2016 History Channel documentary on DB Cooper, had worked as a tech writer at Boeing in the Manuals Department, adjacent to where titanium research on the Super Sonic Transport (SST) was begin conducted in the 1960s.
McCrone had been brought into the DB Cooper case by the cable TV network, Travel Channel, whose Expedition Unknown TV show funded the research. Expedition Unknown aired its own DB Cooper episode this week, which has triggered the renewed interest.
In the Expedition Unknown (EU) broadcast the findings were widely speculated upon. The Rare Earth Metals (REM), in particular the Strontium Sulfide, Yttrium, and Barium Sulfate are used in Cathode Ray Tubes (CRTs) that are critical components in electronic monitors and television sets, which were being introduced into the cockpits of the SST, leading the EU to speculate that the REMs found on the tie were sourced in the use of these devices. Hence, they postulated that DB Cooper may have been a Boeing employee, but in a different capacity than posed earlier by Bob Sailshaw.
Since EU funded the McCrone work, it is directly responsible for this latest development in the Cooper case. This is the first major advancement in the Cooper case since the FBI threw in the towel last July, and indicates that public interest is still substantial and will most likely lead to other private, citizen-based investigations.
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Editor’s Note: Bruce A. Smith is the author of DB Cooper and the FBI – A Case Study of America’s Only Unsolved Skyjacking. It is available from Amazon as an eBook or hard copy.
Below: DB Cooper and his tie: Courtesy of the FBI.
The Mountain News - WA 
I saw this article at KING as well. Since we knew that alleged Cooper accomplice once worked at Boeing on the 727 program, we posted up a link to a download of the file we sent the Seattle FBI on Cooper suspect Ken Christiansen, as well as his alleged accomplice, Bernie Geestman. We already know that Geestman worked for Boeing at the time the 727 was in development. Since we did that, this unedited report has been downloaded more than a hundred times just today, which is a record. (It’s been available to the public for a while) We also sent a message to Ingalls and another to NewsTips at KING with the same information.
I see you are now moderating comments there Bruce. Noted.
My apologies. I didn’t mean to call you out on the modding. That’s your right. If you delete my last two comments, my feelings won’t be hurt. 🙂
I see that Sailswine is still out to get this old geezer. He’s a worse liar that Trump and that is saying something. I maybe a 90 year old World War II Mad Dog Marine with lots of disabilities but I have got to put an end to this.
Yo, Mad Dog, take it easy. Remember, you’re the one who told the world on the History Channel broadcast that you are the “perfect suspect” in the DB Cooper case, so isn’t is understandable that some viewers actually believed you and now want to prove it?
What price for fame and glory, eh?
Editor’s Note: It has come to my attention that a variety of technical glitches may be interfering with posting comments at the Mountain News. One problem is that all new commentators must be approved by me, via email, and my email server crashed a week ago while I was visiting family in NY.
Other posters are reporting that Internet Explorer is not the best platform to use to post at the MN, and suggest that Google Chrome is more reliable.
So, hang in there everybody. We’ll fix things as best we can when trouble arises.
In the meantime, I encourage Cooper sleuths to also visit the DB Cooper Forum, where the topic of the metals on Cooper’s tie is being discussed in detail.
Finding these metals on the tie simply indicates that the wearer of the tie (not directly linked to “Dan Cooper”) worked around electronics. He could have been a TV repairman, aircraft mechanic or a clerk at Radio Shack. Maybe a ham radio hobbyist. No link to Boeing or any other particular company. Interesting, but not really “evidence.”
Internet Explorer and Google Chrome both seem to be working fine for posting comments now. (It was me who reported the problem to Bruce Smith) No worries. Whatever it was, it went away. Temporary server-side problem, most likely. Nothing to do with users visiting, or this news column itself.
I worked on a few construction jobs with suspect Bob Rackstraw and I find it interesting that the brand of cigarettes Raleigh which cooper smoked on the plane is the same that I would bum of bob on work site.
Not saying anything but being a smoker during the time, I noticed K Christiansen pic where I could faintly see the Walter Raleigh cigarette package logo (smoked a few cargos myself during the time) outline faintly through his white shirt. Regarding recent metal clippings on tie metal testing, I know for a fact all management in Aluminum plants of the era were required to wear the standard black clip on their tie in case the tie became caught in machinery while working. Wonder why are they no suspects from those plants? Working shift work, they also would have (5 or so) extra days off after finishing their mid-night shift, leaving extra time for the hijack?
Also, was organized crime (Mafia) considered? They were pretty brazen for a lot less money?
I think all the suspects would never say a thing to anyone unless they were totally innocent and knew there was no possible link or evidence to prove their guilt and prosecution?
Talkers are just enjoying the lime light and notoriety in my opinion. Still think the Aluminium plants… a Kaiser or Reynolds employee possibility should have been checked due to the metal link on the clip on tie.
If you were a walking male during that era you had been to Nam, Korea or WWII, plenty of those around?
A couple of thoughts, Jon.
Mafia: Numerous researchers have speculated on the involvement of organized crime in the Cooper skyjacking, but there is no definitive link that I know of. Nevertheless, I have written about a number of the suggested connections. Perhaps the most intriguing one is the claim by Captain Don Burnworth that his ex wife’s family conspired with the Bruno mafia clan to hire a look-alike to pull the stunt and put Don in jail – the ultimate pay-back, eh?
The finding of metals on the tie is a recent development, and the FBI has done nothing that I know of in investigating this new piece of evidence. Shame on them, I say. Private investigators are all over it, though, such as Tom Kaye and associates and the Tectronix connection.
I encourage you to read my book – DB Cooper and the FBI – and learn more, and come join the fun at the DB Cooper Forum.
Already looked up your book and will purchase it tonight hopefully. Being an old hunter, a Fox will always keeps the rabbit away from the hole and briarpatch were the Fox can make the catch without it getting to cover. Flush it out (term)
FBI, aviation experts, weather techs, jumper’s etc had plenty of time to calculate where Cooper would likely land due to those factors, flaps down, 5,000 -10K feet etc. 200 mile wind etc type of chute and Time.I know I would have given the pilot a flight track which to ease into which was calculated and likely to land Cooper along river, instead of having to send law enforcement people searching the rough terrain and mountains which was very difficult… just like the Fox setting up the Rabbit or any animal does while chasing the prey. Easy boat access, more open for search, and hopefully he would land in the river.kind of drop right into their hands.
As planned, he went straight into the river with the heavy bag of money, probably drowning and $5000 washing up on Tena Sand bar years later.
FBI didn’t just sit around wringing their hands in the 2 1/2 hour delay, They laid out the snare carefully. A friend of mine is an agent and they calculate every move to their advantage to ensure capture. Pilots or FBI would never let you know this secret, as it would be key to actually convicting the real Dan Cooper!
Doubt he made it out, at least with the money tied to his side, but maybe that is what he wanted also, wearing loafers?
Look, here are the Big Problems with the latest evidence on the tie. First, there are SO MANY particles found that there are too many of them now to narrow anything down, save maybe the wearer exposed to a nuclear test or something. Second…there is no clean chain of evidence on the tie. In other words, no one knows who touched it, who tested it and how they did, or the equipment they used to do so…and this is over a period of 45 years. (It’s also been run through DNA testing and a partial profile obtained, which Special Agent Fred Gutt told me in an email and a phone call can eliminate a suspect’s DNA from contention in the case, but cannot confirm him.)
Third, no one can say where Cooper obtained the tie. Another break in the chain of evidence. Did he borrow it from someone? Or did he pick it up at your local Goodwill or Salvation Army store? No one knows. That said, it’s possible the original owner *may* have worked at Boeing. That’s a lot of exotic material on a tie supposed in storage by the FBI since 1971.
Put yourself in the shoes of the hijacker and ask yourself a question for a moment. Why would Cooper carefully retrieve all the other evidence, or dispose of it somehow (SEE: Briefcase with bomb in it.) and just casually toss the tie over one of the seats when he leaped from the jet? Perhaps because he wasn’t worried it could be traced to him. You want a theory from me? Okay, fine. I’ll give you one.
We named NWA employee and ex-paratrooper Ken Christiansen as Cooper, and Bernie Geestman of Port Angeles, WA as his accomplice, with some reluctant cooperation by Geestman’s ex-wife, Margie. Bernie, who lied multiple times to not only me, but the researchers and cast at History Channel for the show ‘Brad Meltzer’s Decoded,’ worked on the Boeing 727 program for a few years before going back to being a mechanic for Northwest Airlines, and later…working for Foss Tugs as a diesel mechanic.
Not sure what people want from me. I just tell it like it is. I’m here all week. 🙂
‘Rick’ says: ‘I worked on a few construction jobs with suspect Bob Rackstraw and I find it interesting that the brand of cigarettes Raleigh which cooper smoked on the plane is the same that I would bum of bob on work site…’
And yet your posted name and link go nowhere…so your testimony could be coming from a second-grader in Bumstead, Indiana. Or perhaps you’re a shill for the Rackstraw Promoters. In addition, Rackstraw was 29 years old at the time of the Cooper hijacking, and had blue eyes. All witnesses, from the guy who sold him the ticket to Seattle, to the people who sat near him on the aircraft, even to the stew who spent hours with him on the plane…all reported Cooper was mid-40’s in age. The FBI’s wanted poster describes the hijacker as having brown eyes as well. Rackstraw is an extreme stretch at best, and did the thing on television that innocent people do. He denied strongly he was guilty, and refused to feed into the people who were hounding him about the hijacking. That’s what INNOCENT people do. They deny, and then shut you out, as Rackstraw did with that ridiculous ‘investigation’ for TV, which was more like the Keystone Cops chasing their tails than anything else.
You should talk to Billy Jensen, the New York guy who was involved in that joke of a television show. See what he says about it now. I did. 🙂
What is true about our investigation? What isn’t? I finally put up a comprehensive answer:
http://unsolved-crimes.freeforums.net/thread/377/abs-investigation-db-cooper-true
Hopefully, this will satisfy people, and set the record straight once and for all.
Why do you point out and agree with the witness testimony when you want to show that someone isn’t cooper. But then you try to discredit that same testimony when someone point out that it doesn’t support your suspect?
I don’t know what you are referring to, Gregory. What witness testimony am I agreeing with and what am I dismissing?
I see your question, which is so general in nature that there is no way to answer it. And since you decided to make fun of the nickname I use for my friend of more than thirty years…Greg the Techie Guy…you start the whole thing out by picking a username with a veiled insult attached to that name. This is the first time I have put up any sort of link to anything on Bruce’s news site. I just figured it was time to set the record straight on certain issues regarding our six-year investigation into a suspect, and the case in general. There is so much baloney out there already concerning what we know, what we don’t, and our position on certain issues in the case.
Most people, if they have a specific question, will ask THAT question, instead of issuing some blanket statement like yours. The Cooper case is so complex that your question really cannot be answered because there IS no real question there.
My apologies. My question was directed at Mr. Blevins. I should have made that more clear. My bad.
Look…I gave the only answer I could. Your question is pretty non-specific. And just for the record, you are not Greg the Techie Guy. He’s on the AB staff and my best friend since Windows 3.0 and before…:)
It’s simple Bob. When you say that Rackstraw isn’t Cooper, you point to the witness descriptions as to the reasons he can’t be Cooper. But, you often cite those same descriptions as being unreliable when defending you boy Kenny, who doesn’t match those descriptions. As far as my name goes, my name is Gregory and I am a techie dude. I never claimed to be your friend of a similar title.
Actually, I said witness descriptions, in general, can be unreliable when people are under stress perhaps. I never suggested that if Kenny were 29 years old that witnesses would incorrectly state to a T that he looked mid-40’s. Rackstraw was given a flat ‘no way’ by stew Tina Mucklow, while stew Flo Schaffner said that Ken’s picture was the closest to anyone she had ever seen to fit the hijacker. Also, there is virtually no other supporting evidence backing Rackstraw as the hijacker.
However, one is not exclusive of the other. Just because I don’t believe there’s a chance in hell that Rackstraw was involved, doesn’t automatically mean Ken was Cooper. That is also unproven. What really amazes me is that the people who investigated Rackstraw pursued such a ridiculous premise for so long, and that History Channel was silly enough to buy into the whole thing. I think Rackstraw did exactly what an innocent guy (at least for television) is supposed to do. He blew them off totally and wouldn’t speak to them. A person who was guilty, or worried about being guilty, would have talked to them to try and cover his ass.
See: *Bernie Geestman and his lies on Brad Meltzer’s Decoded.* He tried lying to History Channel’s Marisa Kagan, and Kagan came back at him with facts. He drove over a hundred miles from Port Angeles, WA to go on the show. That’s what GUILTY people do. Because they can see the writing on the wall. The innocent just give you the finger and start looking for a lawyer.
Do you think you could beat up Bernie Geestman?
Beat up Geestman? The only thing I ever wanted from him was the truth, and I received little enough of that from him. I don’t feel bad about my comments regarding Robert Rackstraw. When I heard he was roughly 15 years younger than all the witness descriptions and had blue eyes, I was both angry and disappointed with the people who wasted their time trying to shove a seriously round peg into a seriously square hole. And I was not the only one to feel that way. I recently ‘blasted’ the book in a review at Amazon, which is the first time I have ever reviewed any Cooper-related book.
Look…if Rackstraw’s the guy, then you have to come up with some really strong evidence to prove it because he has so many basic strikes against him from the start. The burden is tough here. You’re asking people to believe YOU are right, and all the witnesses were wrong. All of them, not just some of them. It’s a tough order, and a steep hill to climb.
If you have specific questions about KC or Geestman, etc you could contact me privately and I will be happy to answer. But Bruce Smith’s article really isn’t about KC anyway, so this isn’t the place to discuss it. It isn’t even about Rackstraw, but more on the tie.
Gregory Techie Dude says: “As far as my name goes, my name is Gregory and I am a techie dude. I never claimed to be your friend of a similar title.”
Well, you never actually claimed to be anybody. My identity is well-known. The fact that you selected that username when it’s been mentioned dozens of times on both the Cooper Forum and two of our own websites at AB leads me to believe your choice was either the biggest coincidence in history, or you decided to pick at us a bit. No big deal, though.
I get a lot of questions about the case, or Kenny in general, in my email box. When people do that, they generally identify themselves. It’s the polite thing to do, rather than hiding and sniping from behind a rock. If you have any further questions, you can email me. That address is almost certainly known to you, and if it isn’t you can find it easily. It’s pretty much public record by now. Otherwise, I have to assume you are just another shill for the Rackstraw folks.
At what point did I ever claim that I thought Rackstraw was Cooper? I never said that. Let me be clear: I think Rackstraw is a horrible suspect to be Cooper. No way he was the guy. He’s right up there with Kenny boy, as far as improbably suspects go. I was simply pointing out how you use the witness descriptions to your advantage when you need to dismiss a suspect (and accurately done with Rackstraw, I might add), but then you dismiss that same witness testimony when it doesn’t support Kenny boy as Cooper. That’s my point, not that Rackstraw is Cooper.
Now, do you think that you can whip Bernie?
I can understand your feelings about KC as the hijacker. People are generally polarized about him. Either they are certain he’s the guy, or they are adamantly convinced he isn’t. I get messages all the time about it. Doesn’t seem to be many ‘maybes’ with him. However, lately the comments are running more heavily in favor of him being a solid suspect, the people who say these things often say they’ve read the report on him, or have seen the video(s).
Sometimes I get the idea that certain people really don’t want to know who Cooper was, because that would negate their very reason for existence. This is not my problem. I’m just one of the people who went out into the field to check out the evidence. Just the messenger.
So, do you think you could take Bernie in a fight?
As I said, if you have any other (*serious*) questions, you can post them here, but email would be better. I don’t go in for baiting. Gave that up some time ago.
NEWS: I have been offered an option arrangement for my Cooper book by a feature film company in Los Angeles, and spoke to the main producers today via conference call. (They are also the main company execs) They have been following both me and the KC story for a long time, they told me. I hardly had to fill them in on a thing. They were extremely well-informed on KC and Geestman’s story. I get the final offer on Monday afternoon, which I will certainly accept since they want to stick to the truth on Kenny and not propose a comedy, as CBS films tried to sell me on back in 2012, I believe. (CBS later optioned Skyjack by Geoff Gray and named Will Gluck (‘Friends With Benefits’) as the director, but no movie yet.) These guys are determined to do the picture, they said, and were happy to hear the film rights were still available. And yes…I did check them out on IMDB etc before we did the conference call.
Got really quiet after I said that. The problem with believing that one little group has total control over all opinions regarding Cooper, and consider themselves royalty of a sort…is that there is this OTHER thing called ‘the public’. And these folks might not be sold by an all-out, totally-negative program. Especially against an individual who has made everything freely available to the public.
They (the public) begin to smell a rat, and then wonder why some people would take the trouble to go so negative as they do. When you have two entities that go on like this, the tendency is to believe the person who practices openness with the public, and doesn’t shut out other voices because they think that person might be a threat to them somehow, or to their reason for existence.
This is why, in the end, the DB Cooper Forum began to be seen by many people as a slanted site, which doesn’t represent all voices in the case. It’s a closed convention, and run by people who base their decisions more on popularity contests than actually seeking the truth. They do make a good show of it, but lurking in the background there is a dark side to the whole thing.
Believe it or not…people notice these things.
“Got really quiet after I said that”….. You said it at 10Pm, doofus.
Whatever. You never came on board this article for anything good. And you made the mistake of thinking everyone else besides yourself is dumb. Here is the lesson:
Drop a little truth on people, and they just fall to pieces, or fly off the handle. Or like you, resort to name-calling when they have nothing else to provide to the conversation. I saw right through you from the start.
Truth??? You wouldn’t know truth if it bit you on the ass.
By the way, could you whip Bernie in a fight?
Are you trying to say you don’t believe what I said back there on a couple of subjects? I thought I made it fairly plain. First, there was the link to the list of items regarding our involvement in the Cooper case that are perfectly truthful. Maybe you didn’t like me doing that. Then there was the announcement that I’m going to option a certain proprety on Monday afternoon. Maybe you don’t like that either. That’s okay, as I said before. The idea of Kenny as the hijacker is a polarizing subject. But you have to understand that not everyone holds with your views about him, and not everyone believes I just made it all up, which I did not.
There is a hell of a lot more truth in Kenny’s story than for example…that silly show they produced on Rackstraw. I wouldn’t say they lied, though. They just got it wrong. The whole thing was more funny than anything else. The same week that History Channel premiered the show, the FBI was serving warrants on the production company and taking their computers and paper records because their bookkeeper was extorting the company and engaging in embezzlement. No one said a peep about all that over at the Cooper Forum. I did, in a WordPress article that even showed the complaint filed.
Could I beat Bernie Geestman in a fight? You really want your answer, don’t you? And you think you have one coming, even when you don’t have the courtesy (or the guts) to introduce yourself. (‘Hi, I’m Robert. How ya doing?’ is an example) Here’s my answer:
Only if he decided to take us to court. He wouldn’t have a chance.
Actually Bob, you are in the minority on Kenny boy. Very few people believe he was Cooper. Sure, a movie could be done that could convince some folks that have only a passing knowledge of Cooper that Kenny boy was the guy. But, so what? The FBI has spoken and Kenny isn’t the guy. End of story. Do the movie, I doubt anyone really cares. I certainly don’t, but I don’t speak for anyone else on any forum or elsewhere.
Here’s a serious question for you: Is the money plant going to be a part of this supposed movie? I’ve yet to see you back off of your theory that the money was planted by Kenny boy, even though it was confirmed a few months back that there were shards of money found well below the bundles of case. This of course, eliminates the possibility of a plant. Your thoughts, Bob?
My email box sometimes gets flooded with positive messages regarding KC. If you’ve taken a poll regarding how many folks believe Kenny was Cooper, you didn’t take it with the public, but a small group of Cooper fans, many of whom really don’t WANT to know Cooper’s identity. It would negate their whole purpose for existence.
The video on Kenny is approaching 50,000 views at YouTube and upvotes far outnumber downvotes to it. Comments I make about the video have links that lead to more evidence, or to other websites with further information, including the report we subbed to the Seattle FBI.
If you were keeping up on these things, you would know I already proposed my final theory on the Tena Bar money. I think it was placed inside a biodegradable container (probably a paper bag or the like) and was tossed into the Columbia sometime after the FBI bypassed the Statute of Limitations on November 24, 1976. I think this money ended up being dredged and deposited at Tena Bar. Some was chopped up by the wiper bar in the dredge pipe perhaps, while three bundles escaped most damage during the process. The fact that three bundles were found in the same exact spot means the chances they fell from the sky are pretty remote. And I don’t think the money went into the Columbia a whole long way from Tena Bar, either. I accept the flight path, as stated by the FBI maps to be accurate, so this seems the most reasonable explanation.
That’s my best theory on the money. Too bad we can’t ask Kenny, but who knows? Maybe Geestman will finally come forward. You never know. Those folks over at the Cooper Forum spend a lot of time discussing particles on a tie, but failed to notice that a senior FBI agent named John Jarvis already told three witnesses last August WHY the FBI closed the case, and WHO the hijacker was. It’s just another example of holding your hands over your ears. Does anyone REALLY believe I would name an active FBI agent working out of Quantico without some proof? That would be totally nuts, and I could expect the Feds to come pounding on my door about it. Oh, it’s true all right. And all three witnesses have current security clearances. I told the production company their full names and gave the full testimony and their backgrounds.
I wanted to add something here. I get that comment ‘KC was already dismissed by the FBI, so that’s it’ comment sometimes. And repeatedly…I have to remind people of the actual facts on it. The FBI initially dismissed KC as a suspect in early 2008, and that dismissal was based solely on the original October 2007 article by Geoff Gray. Our investigation into KC and Geestman didn’t even begin until mid-2009 or so. By 2011/12, after I subbed some early findings to the Seattle FBI on these two, the FBI started telling me that NO…KC had NOT been eliminated or dismissed as a suspect. Again…(hopefully the final time) I will quote message (and phone call which came later) from the Seattle FBI’s Fred Gutt. It came after I asked them if KC had been eliminated as a suspect:
“You are wrong in your assumption that Kenny Christiansen has been eliminated as a suspect in the case. No one has been eliminated, and the case remains open. Some in this office believe he’s a good suspect. Others believe there are better suspects…”
The FBI does not believe Kenny boy to be Cooper. Period. How close was John Jarvis to the Cooper case? Is this just common knowledge among all FBI agents that they know it was Kenny? If not, then what position is Jarvis in to have access to this information? The FBI would love to close this case, and I promise you that if they knew who it was – dead or alive – they would announce it. It makes no sense to close it because the guy is dead, and not say so. Remember, they went after LD for a long time, knowing full well he was dead. There’s no logic there at all.
If you and Bernie were to get in a fight, would you fare better than the Seahawks did last week?
Excuse me…but since WHEN do you speak for the FBI? How do YOU know their thought process? Are you an FBI agent? You talk as if you work there. I don’t know you, although I can tell you’ve been following me and my work for a while. Most likely, you’re a member of the DB Cooper Forum, the site run by Dave B, aka ‘Shutter’. Both myself and certain members of the media know what their thoughts are regarding Christiansen.
Don’t know what you want from me. Did you bother to read the 54-page report on Christiansen, the one with the pics and documents? Have you seen the 90-minute video at YouTube where I present the evidence? Almost 50,000 people have, but maybe you missed it.
Do you expect me to take up space on Bruce Smith’s news site arguing the case against Kenny back and forth with someone who doesn’t have the manners identity him (or her) self? If you have specific questions, why don’t you go to the source. I have an email, and it’s not like people don’t ask. I get at least 25 emails a week about either Cooper or Kenny etc. And what makes you believe you deserve special consideration above and beyond the media folk or private folk who have manners and courtesy when they approach me. If you hang with the Cooper Forum folks, my advice is to stop believing all the hype and baloney they dump on you there about me and deal in reality.
Let me guess…they told you I was crazy, and a liar. They said ‘no one listens to him anyway.’ Uh, huh. Right. You’d be surprised. I am uploading a new video tonight at YouTube. It’s my interview from December 23, 2016 with Doug Hagmann. It was part of a three-hour news and interview show, but it’s been edited down to just the 90 minute interview itself, with front and back credits added. Kinda busy, but I don’t mind taking time for you…within reason.
I keep wondering why Bruce Smith has nothing to say about all of this. It’s HIS site, after all. The video I mentioned will be available at 11PM Pacific at a certain website you probably already know.
Everything I have needed to say, and have wanted to say, about Kenny Christiansen, I said in my book: “DB Cooper and the FBI – A Case Study of America’s Only Unsolved Skyjacking.”
I haven’t seen or heard anything in the past year to change my mind. To wit, I agree with Larry’s Carr assessment that KC is not DBC.
Tricky to put all your eggs in one basket there, Bruce. When Carr said that KC wasn’t Cooper, he based it solely on the New York Magazine article by Geoff Gray, and that was nearly ten years ago. Our investigation didn’t begin for more than a year later. You’d be surprised what we discovered in that time. However, I do understand about the polarization regarding Christiansen as a suspect.
What I don’t understand was why you refused to come on board with the film production company. Are you that eager to please the folk at The DB Cooper Forum, that you would cut off your nose to spite your face, just to remain popular with them? Maybe you should be your man once in a while and participate in something that actually benefits you and your book. Monday afternoon I will be signing the option that could have had your name on it, too. But as usual, I will have to go it alone. Seems okay to me. Results have been good so far.
I’m going to tell you a secret. Media types DO drop by the DBC Forum once in a while. Maybe they see the whole thing differently than the actual members who post there. My own opinion, (which yes…doesn’t matter) is that the site is non-inclusive, occasionally allows members to bash anyone not in that group, and doesn’t represent all voices in the Cooper case. On the pictures and links bit, they do okay. But a compresensive site for the public on the Cooper case? Not really. And others see that as well. If you want to become the Be All and End All in the Cooper Case, you have be perfectly open to the public and have some manners. Otherwise, you start getting blown off by both the public and the media.
To answer your question, yes I have read your report on Kenny boy. Twice.
Your theory on the money makes no sense. Why would the hijacker put the money in a bag and then toss in into the water? For starters it would sink. But that isn’t the real issue. If he did that, he would obviously be doing it for someone to find, right? So if someone found this money, and it was in this paper bag or whatever, that does not show that the hijacker died, but rather that he lived. The money wasn’t in paper bags when it was given to the hijacker. So finding it in one would show human intervention after the fact. You can’t tell me that his plan was to put the money in a bag, have it sink and be dredged up, and then found years later!! But, the problem is that you need the paper bag for your theory to work. Anyone with half of a brain can shoot that theory down easily.
No one, including me, claims to know how and under what circumstances the money arrived at Tena Bar. NO ONE.
There are theories. Find the hijacker or someone who worked with him, get them to confess, and then maybe you’ll know. The Tena Bar question has gone around and around for years, not only here, or at the DBC Forum, but at Dropzone as well. Some people think this, others that. No one the hell knows for sure.
My main focus during my investigation into KC and Geestman has been KC and Geestman, not the Tena Bar money. But everybody seems to have an opinion. One guy thinks the flight path was wrong by at least six miles and Cooper landed there. Tom Kaye was quoted in Skyjack saying he thought ‘human intervention’ was involved. Others believe Cooper landed in the Columbia closer to Portland and the money drifted to Tena Bar. Still others think the Washougal theory is still good.
Truth is, I don’t know for sure HOW in the hell that money got there. Some facts are available. Shards deeper than the money find could indicate dredging. The FBI scaled back its search after the money was discovered and started telling people they thought it meant Cooper was dead. Personally, I don’t believe the money was out in the elements for nine years. One reason I believe this is because I know stuff rots to hell pretty quick in Washington state when it’s exposed to the elements, or buried, especially if it’s biodegradable. I’ve often camped in the same spots multiple times and found where people buried their paper garbage or old clothes in the same fire pit the summer before. Most of the time, it’s all gone to hell and in shreds, or the paper turns to mush.
It’s the biggest mystery of the Cooper case unless you can prove that Cooper actually DID land near Tena Bar. And so far there is no evidence of that. In fact, all the available evidence points to the opposite. I made a guess. It’s no better or worse than the other guesses, but at least I didn’t try to move the flight path by miles. True, no one knows who actually created the FBI’s flight path map, but we do know it was created based on radar information from at least two sources. And I believe it is accurate. They didn’t just guess at it. Paul Soderlind from NWA and his team undoubtably had at least some say in it, that’s also my belief, and Soderlind is no slouch, I assure you.
None of this answers the Big Tena Bar Money question. And nothing probably ever will, unless they find additional evidence (body, briefcase, additional money, parachute) in the same area.
But, would you not agree that the presence of the shards, feet below the money find, makes it hard to push any kind of plant theory. Seriously, tossing the money into the Columbia is not a way to plant the money.
For me, any suspect or Cooper theory that does not provided a reasonable explanation for BOTH money finds is incomplete. Further, in lieu of hard evidence directly linked to a suspect, such as money or parts of the parachute, etc, a solid T-Bar explanation is mandatory.
Put yourself into the shoes of the hijacker, and consider HOW you would do some type of a plant if you decided to try it. First, WHY would you bother? It’s been my belief that Cooper might have tried that once he discovered that the FBI had gone around the Statute of Limitations.
If you bury the money anyplace, someone’s going to figure out it was buried. If you just toss money onto the ground in the woods, the FBI’s going to search that area thoroughly, and not finding your body, the chute, or anything else…they will know you are alive. Water, or someplace NEXT to water, is the only believable scenario.
If Cooper is now dead, then ‘proving’ how the money arrived is not a requirement to convict a suspect. There are other ways to do that. Cooper, if he is dead, might be the only person who knew how the money got there. But he might not be the only person who knew he WAS Cooper. The revelation by Special Agent John Jarvis came just a month after the FBI ‘dismissed’ the case. Don’t you think it’s strange that the FBI would even bother with that? They have other cases far older than Cooper on the books…why would they suddenly pick Cooper to dismiss, and do it right about the time they allowed themselves to be questioned in the Rackstraw case?
On a more personal note, I have some regrets that Bruce Smith refused to come on board with the film producers in Los Angeles. I have a message from them today. The only thing to be settled is how much on the upfront option payment, and how much on the film budget. Money is nice, sure. But being involved in the first serious feature film on DB Cooper is much more satisfying to me than just money. It’s pretty much a done deal now, I’m told. They’re going to shoot the film, and fairly soon. It’s hard for me to believe that Bruce just turned down my more than generous offer to include him, and his book, with an equal split, and equal credits.
He didn’t even answer the messages I sent him. I won’t make any negative comments about all this here. It’s his news site, not mine. But I think later he will regret his choice. That’s just an opinion. Perhaps he is waiting for something better. But since no one’s done the serious feature film on Cooper in the nearly half-century since the hijacking, it’s doubtful another one will be done for a while. You can’t provide imput, or benefit from something like that, unless you provide imput.
“The only thing to be settled is how much on the upfront option payment, and how much on the film budget.”
This means they pay you a certain amount for the option, and a percentage of the stated film budget. The option payment is done after you sign the option contract. The percentage of film budget is paid on the first day of filming. If the film goes over budget, you receive no additional payment. Because I am providing certain files, other imput, and advising on the script, I get listed as one of the producers as well.
Too many posts in a row. I will keep this short. The KC book has now been officially optioned for a feature film by an LA-based production company. The terms were both fair and generous. They are actually going to messenger over the contract tomorrow. Say what you will, but it will be the first feature film ever done on the Cooper hijacking. Wish us luck. More details available if you know where to look. I’ve done my last post to this article, and feel somewhat hoggish about it. I would have announced it at The DB Cooper Forum, but…(*smiles*) can’t do that for you.
I guess congratulations are in order Mr. Blevins. You have finally accomplished what you set out to accomplish and parlay your Kenny Christiansen work into a big payday. Of course, there is that small detail that – even by your own admission – you don’t know that Kenny was the hijacker. But hey, let’s don’t let detail get in the way of a payday. Personally, I could never take a payday as the result of slandering a couple of folks, but that’s just me. I guess if you can sleep at night, then good for you. Congratulations.
I didn’t ‘parlay’ anything into anything, there Parrot. That company has been following me for over a year without my knowledge. And I previously turned down a 25K offer for the rights. While you and yours over there put your hands over your ears and tried shutting Kenny’s story out of the picture, more sensible folks were actually checking it out. And just so you’ll know…they researched you guys as well and didn’t like a lot of the stuff they saw over there…like Georger and Shutter’s unending tirades about me, his ‘Suspects’ page with only a single suspect listed trying to trash him, and a host of other things I can’t say here. Problem was…you guys went way overboard, while I was making files and other evidence public record. And telling the truth isn’t slander. It’s just the truth. You’re right when you say I’ve qualified things by noting that I can’t be absolutely sure that KC and Geestman are guilty. But after all that’s happened with Geestman’s family lately, I would say I’m at 90% or better those two were guilty as hell.
People have called me the ‘venom magnet,’ and yet I can show you where the real venom was all along. Galen Cook’s ridiculous posts over at the DBC Forum that got so bad I had threaten to send his posts to the Washington State Bar to get him to stop. Shutter’s emails to me where he calls me this and that, and then brags I can’t respond to them. Over 300 absolutly FILTHY comments to a harmless article on KC, where some of the IP’s were traced to people who hang out where you do now. That one caused a perfectly nice lady named Regina to get permanently banned from WordPress. Take a look around your own place before you judge me too harshly.
You have a short memory. Let me remind you, that it was I that pointed out all of those filthy comments to you. If I had known we were going to have to hear about them until the end of time, I would probably have just let it go and said nothing.
I prepared a PDF of those comments and listed the true identities and IP addresses of the ones we were able to trace. I never made it public, which means even I have certain morals when it comes to retribution. In other words, even I won’t stoop as low as some of those people who made the posts. That document will never see the light of day, although a few times I’ll admit I was tempted.
Some of the folks at the Cooper Forum misjudged me. They thought I made stuff up, or just lied on witness testimony. About the only thing I really got wrong was that Kenny paid cash for the house in Bonney Lake. But I got that from Geoff Gray’s article in 2007 and Skipp Porteous bought into it as well. Found out later he financed half through the same bank that paid the ransom (he assumed the mortgage) and then signed a promissory note for the other half. Who signs a note like that for $7,500 when they take home $512 a month before taxes? Only if he had the money…and the guy who hooked him up with the owners (Ann and Joe Grimes) was the Best Man at the Grimes wedding. Geestman, who else? The consummate liar, the burglar of his ex-wife’s house just barely after Kenny died.
We’re going with what we have, and that’s that. If Geestman wants to sue, my lawyer will put him up for depositions and some tricky questions. He won’t do it. He knows better. His own family knows better. I also believe the FBI spoke to a few of them sometime after August 2015. Then they dismiss the case, something they don’t normally do. Then SA John Jarvis tells three solid witnesses that the REAL reason the FBI closed the case was because they found out who the hijacker was…that he was dead anyway…and that he was Christiansen. Along with their whitewash BS regarding the Amboy chute, it doesn’t take a genius to figure out what happened.
I will try to make sure that the script is accurate as possible, and try not to embellish the story beyond what we know. As far as the Bryan Woodruff issue, it’s no surprise to me that they left his interview for Travel Channel on the cutting room floor. I watched as they filmed it. I call this KARMA. AB of Seattle put out max effort and much money to help him, and he returned the favor by stealing from us, (accepted expenisve items in donation that never came up at the auction) and then trashed us a few days on Facebook. I won’t ever try to visit the place again, nor do I ever want to speak to him again.
The Wodruff thing is between you and him, I won’t comment on it.
You also got wrong the supposed visit to Lyle Christiansen from a couple of Feds to get a DNA sample. Somebody lied there. As far as the house purchase, you make a lot of assumptions there. You assume he paid the previous owner off quickly but have no evidence of that. We know he didn’t pay the mortgage off quickly, but that doesn’t matter, since it would hurt your theory. You have absolutely nothing that is verifiable that points to KC. But there is plenty that points away from him. The description from Flo and Tina, the money find at Tina Bar and the latest findings on the tie all point away from Kenny being the guy.
That’s right on Lyle. An agent met him near his house and they spoke in the agent’s car. No sample was taken. Son of house owner Joe Grimes said ‘no way’ would his dad have waited long for his $7,500, and taking 19 years to pay off the other half seems weird somehow, especially when we know Kenny was making land purchases here and there and spending on his little coin/stamp thing. Can’t question Grimes because he and his wife passed not long after 2000. The tie has no chain of evidence and all that contamination just makes it worse. Who handled it? Etc. I don’t know. I do know that the route between either Geestman’s place, or Kenny’s apartment in Sumner to the SeaTac Airport goes right past the old JC Penney’s in Auburn, because in 1971 there wasn’t any Highway 167. I lived in that area, and I know this. I once posted a map with illustrations about it.
I’ve also made a decision regarding the ‘other’ website, the one Cooper Forum users sometimes visit just to see what’s happening. I’m going to shut it down for good after the weekend of March 17th when I return from vacation. I don’t see the point in continuing it further, and we only have 14 members anyway, some of whom are members of Kenny’s family. Further updates, I will just put on the DB Cooper page at our main website and leave it at that. I may establish a simple site about the upcoming film with just a contact form, as I have seen others do with such things.
Sure…we could battle over KC/Geestman from here to eternity. But I don’t see the point of going down that road any further. Most of the people who comment on KC, or email me about him, are polarized. That means…they either strongly believe he was Cooper, or they strongly believe he WASN’T. Doesn’t seem to be any middle ground on him. No ‘maybes’ as they say.
I think by eliminating that particular website, that members of the Cooper Forum can then be the sole website discussing the case, and that will be that. Tell you the truth, I’m getting a little tired of it all and I do plan on moving out of Washington State in less than three years, probably to the Kingman, AZ area. This place is a good middle spot between my folks in the Mesa area and Gayla’s mom in Vista, CA. Seattle is a nice place, but its expensive to live here, the traffic is just awful, and the roads are crap. It’s really time for all the stuff that has gone around and around to come to a halt. I’ll go along with what’s happening now, and give it my full support, but after that I am moving on. This June it will be eight years I’ve been involved in this Cooper thing, and frankly I have had just about enough of it. I have to assist on this latest project, which was a surprise for sure, but after that, all bets are off. I’m due to release my autobiography by June and that must be done as well.
Look…one last comment and then I will leave this all alone. When the film comes out, people are undoubtably going to come out of the woodwork on Kenny and Bernie. And although…yes…I am pretty sure they were the perps, the truth is going to emerge on them somehow, sooner or later. Probably sooner. Then we’ll all know whether Skipp and I (and some other folks who contributed along the way) were right or wrong.
And besides…it’s good for the investigation as a whole, even for you folks at the DBC Forum. It will bring major attention to the case again. Maybe for the last time. Try to roll with that and not judge me too harshly. I was never in this for a buck. To be frank with you, I may not have much personally, and maybe I was stupid for turning down all the previous money offered to me for TV, etc. But my folks are certainly NOT poor, and my sister and I are their only living kin. Okay? Now you know why I kept turning down the money. Because I didn’t care about money. When I made the deal with the film company, I signed the contract and took only enough money to send them 100 copies of the book and cover the cost of some sending them mass copies of some hi-res photos they wanted. And that was it. The rest of it was Hollywood rules on payment for film contributions, and I took the minimum, which was two percent less than they offered me. Finding out the truth about Kenny and Bernie means a lot more to me than frickin’ money. The amount in the trust fund my mother suggested I could borrow from to help Bryan Woodruff remodel his store would have done the job ten times over. Gayla and I were considering doing this right after I returned from the Ariel Party. We were sooo excited about doing that. And then two days later Bryan goes on his Facebook tirade without even warning us first he had a problem. When I left the party, he shook my hand and thanked me. His friend Tina Strong gave me a big hug and did the same thing. Two days later, I go to Facebook and…well, you know the rest. Gayla got so pissed at him I had to stop her from calling him the phone to bite his head off. We decided right there we never wanted anything to do with him again. And hell…I even helped him move his frickin’ pot plants before the party so Travel Channel and attendees wouldn’t see them. (*smiles*)
Some of you guys just misjudged me on a lot of things. I don’t hold that against you because yes…when I get hold of a bone on something like this, I may have chased it pretty hard and probably pissed some people off. And for that…I will apologize. But I was never in it for the money. My life was better BEFORE Skipp Porteous approached me, but now I have to see it out to the end.
And then…that’s it.
I signed in from my phone last night and for some reason my name showed up as “thewholetruth71”. Evidently I signed up for a wordpress account at some time. Don’t remember doing it, but there it is.
I don’t think I have misjudged you Robert. I want to see the case solved and I don’t have any vested interest in who did it. It wouldn’t bother me if it turned out to be KC. I know that’s hard for you to believe, but that’s the truth. However there is such a thing as credibility, and I think yours is heavily damaged. You banged the “Kenny paid cash for his house” gong for a long long time. Then, with a few internet searches, some others uncovered the truth on that. That’s one of the first things you should have looked for. The Lyle thing is another. You beat it to death until you were pressed on it, and then we find out the truth. No DNA was taken even though we were told that it was for the longest time. What does Joe Grimes son know specifically about the sale of the house?? From what I’ve gathered, nothing. You just make an assumption that he wanted the money immediately. It’s an assumption made with no verifiable evidence to back it up. Credibility issues Robert. Your whole case against Kenny is assumptions, with no verifiable evidence. Porteus did not do a thorough investigation, and you followed it up with a sloppy one. That’s the truth.
Well, like I said, in order to verify the evidence that was presented against KC and Bernie, this would require taking the 54-page report we issued to the Seattle FBI about him (containing our best contact information on everyone who was named in one way or another) and doing a bit of legwork on it. Not once in all this time did I ever hear of someone actually doing that at the DBC Forum, or by Bruce Smith, or any of the other active investigators in the case. It isn’t like I didn’t give you the tools to do so. Everything we presented was an open book, and made freely available to the public. Some people actually looked at what we presented. That report was downloaded thousands of times since its initial release, and continues to be downloaded every week in large numbers. Varies from week to week, but it’s steady.
The problem is…some others did check it out. I have a small office with these oak drawers crammed with the information, photographs, interview notes, letters, etc. Pretty extensive stuff.
As far as credibility goes, except for the time I joined the DBC Forum at the start of it and passed myself off as someone else just to piss off Shutter (and I told him who I was soon afterward) I have never used a phony identity to attack someone else unfairly just because I could. And even then I just looked around out of curiosity. That would be several key people who are well-known in Cooperland. The same people you support now, the ones you have supported in the past. So please don’t talk to me of ‘credibility’ when this happens. You lie down with dogs, you gonna get fleas every time.
Look…if I said there was nothing to the tie evidence, I was WRONG. Any new evidence in the Cooper case is GOOD.
I have reviewed the contract offered to me and decided to sign it. Out of courtesy, I told Bruce Smith the details privately.
I’m going to unsubscribe from this article now.
Guest access to the ‘other’ site on Cooper is temporarily closed to guests until I figure out how to re-vamp, or perhaps delete-and-replace the whole thing with something else.
If you have any questions, most of you know where I can be reached.
I came back to drop a bomb on you. After careful consideration, I’ve decided NOT to sign the option deal to make KC’s story into a feature film. Why? Because I didn’t like the company who offered it. And I’m not going to tell you why, or who they were. I’m in no big hurry to sell Kenny’s story, and have turned away other offers. Money is important, but other things are more important. Like living. Or having fun. Or doing what you want to do instead of what you WISH you could be doing. Who knows? Maybe I’ll just produce it myself and release it direct-to-DVD. (*smiles*) I certainly have the gear and tech for that.
This is what I will do. Work hard for the next few weeks on my autobiography, and then take a week-long trip into the Olympics to shoot video and stills, not all of them about DB Cooper. I’m doing this over the weekend of March 17th.
DB Cooper is starting to drop severely on my list of things I ‘have’ to do. The FBI report is easily downloaded and many have done so. The book is there. Our cabinets are stuffed with files, photos, letters, and documents on the investigation, and any key emails have been stored on multiple servers for future use. I answer all the email questions and phone calls. Do you know how tiresome that gets?
I would rather go camping and BBQ chicken, while watching my DVD set of Breaking Bad, than deal with more Cooper Stuff.
Nah. I say we just turn the movie guys away and wait and see if something better comes along. You never know. Every day is an adventure. My main job in all of this was to discover the truth, not make a cheap buck. I do have morals, you know. I’m already prepping my gear for a week of fun in the Olympic Mountains come March.
Oops. Back up now…(“We’re stayin’, we’re goin’…make up your minds!” Armageddon) The film company comes back with better offer. Okay…we’ll go with it after all. But I’m still going camping March 17.
I apologize for the multiple posts, but since our own site is currently no-guests-right-now, Cooper Fans should know the truth. We had a bit of last-second jitters signing the option agreement. After a conference call from the producers, everything was fine. Enough said.
Just curious, how many time are you going to go on to you memberless forum and cry about not being allowed on Shutter’s site?? I’d spank my son’s ass if he cried all time like you do. Just sayin’.
Parrothead Vol asks:
‘Just curious, how many time are you going to go on to you memberless forum and cry about not being allowed on Shutter’s site?? I’d spank my son’s ass if he cried all time like you do. Just sayin’.’
I have absolutely no desire to post there. That is a place where one person decides what you should see, or should NOT see regarding the Cooper hijacking. Links and pictures posted by you and others are not visible to the public. That’s really dumb, by the way. Especially if you’re trying to attract the attention of the media or the public to your work on the case. ‘Links are not visible to guests. Register or Login.’
I wouldn’t touch that place with a ten-foot pole, Parrot. Not a chance in hell. For example, I’ll bet ‘The Biggest Website on DB Cooper,’ (that would be the site you mentioned) didn’t even realize something huge in happening in the Cooper case.
Actually, Shutter knows all about it. He just likes to decide what you can see in the case, and what you can’t. But then he was a big supporter of Donald Trump, and sent me multiple nasty emails talking not only about Trump, but bragging I couldn’t respond to his messages because he had blocked my address.
Fearless Leader might not be everything he says. At least he stopped sending the nasty emails. I will give him that.
Try something based in reality on the case: https://thedbcooperhijacking.wordpress.com/2017/02/02/d-b-cooper-book-on-ken-christiansen-optioned-for-feature-film/
By the way…we have picked up a few members here and there. I don’t care how many there are, although I think it’s 17 right now. If there were more, I would have to do more moderating. Guest visits are plenty enough for me.
Duane Weber worked for the Modulus Corp in 1969 and 1970…I have the W-2’s.
Both yrs his main source of income supplemented with work at Cherokee town & Country Club and Thirteenth & Baltimore Corp and Annbar Associtaes Hotel Muehlebach & Interlock screw & Bolt Corp & The Midnight Sun (a dinner club). His main source of income both yrs was Modulus Corporation (again his main source of income). He sold a little insurance during both of those yrs.
Check out the Modulus Corp and what they made and sold in 1969 and 1970…..I already know the answer – but perhaps the FBI needs to look a little more deeply into the history of Duane Weber.
Also what did he do under his other name – John Collins.
Well, the FBI is not going to do this – so I need the help of the public…I found some information on the Modulus Corp and what I found will shock you – I do not understand the depth of what I have found as I didn’t understand a lot of it….but they made parts for the Space ships that made the MOON LANDING and BOEING 727’s. They developed or made a window of some kind that could take the heat & pressure for the space ships and the airplanes….they made other parts for both of the above.
I do not normally post anywhere – but I need the help of the public on this one…WHAT did I find?
Also note that Duane claimed to have known one of the men who made a Moon Landing – I take that as someone he met or who had connections with his family…after all they were engineers and his brother worked for Boeing for many yrs – retired from Boeing along with his best friend whose wife was the daughter of Duane’s mother’s best friend. The other Boeing person was Stanley Gilliam.
Stanley Gilliam recieved a phone call about 2 wks before the skyjacking…and the person asked about the 727 and the question was specific. Stanley married the daughter of Duane’s Mother’s best friend. The Barth are the reason the Weber’s moved to California in the 1940’s as they said there was Jobs there…and so when Duane got out of the Army he went to CA where his parents were living…at that point – and for the next 10 yrs or so – Weber was exposed to the Boeings and to other individual in what has become Cooper world.
Jo Weber: Better take a second look at those W-2’s….
From the Modulus Corp website:
“Modulus Inc.
Modulus is a contract manufacturer **established in 1972** and has remained in the heart of Silicon Valley. We help customers bring to market highly innovative products, some of which are recognized as firsts in the manufacturing industry.”
Since Parrothead Vol gave me such a hard time in comments, and I have seen the Woo Hoo Falcons post at the DB Cooper Forum website, I had to say this elsewhere:
I have to do the ha-ha thing over the Atlanta Falcons historic loss in the Super Bowl. They handed Tom Brady the role of Greatest Quarterback Ever, and consider this: The record for teams coming back in ANY NFL postseason game from a deficit of 19 points or more is 0-93. That’s right. Never in the history of postseason NFL football had ANY team come back to win after being down nineteen points or more. (Patriots were down by 25 at one point)
You can now add a ‘1’ to that statistic, where the zero once resided. Falcons managed to do the biggest collapse in Super Bowl and postseason history, a feat that will probably never be repeated. Falcon fans must be walking around in shock right now, like Super Bowl Zombies. Kind of like that scene from the movie, ‘The Sand Pebbles,’ when Steve McQueen asks at the end, “What the hell HAPPENED?”
Robert, why do you constantly take things out of context? you were blocked for a reason. it has nothing to do with bragging, that all YOU do? since you can’t argue with others on your own forum (due to lack of members) you come here and fill up the comment box with promotional crap about Kenny?
You claimed months ago to have contacted the Seattle FBI about the ridiculous claim of the case being closed due to Kenny being dead, why a second one? the first was a lie? Bruce got a response that was about your claim? you also claimed to let the media handle it, another lie? I love the fact vs opinion claim?
your main goal is to try and discredit people. why is it ok for you to blast Tom Colbert, and the History channel? that would make you a detractor, no? it’s ok for you to have an opinion, but nobody else when it comes to Kenny?
you make claims like the media doesn’t care about us after reading the thread, really? 4 members from my forum were on a national television show, and the best evidence in years in regards to the Cooper case was uncovered by Tom Kaye? you try and discredit me and my forum constantly , then turn around and do the same thing you whine about, like closing the public out. you tried closing your forum “permanently” in January only to reopen it days later, now once again you are “permanently” closing it again? I also failed to see you in the credits on Expedition Unknown?
much like tying up the thread as you did on the DZ, as well as here you started the same crap with emails, so I blocked you. this is not bragging, it’s called necessary! I am not obligated to report anything about you. you whine either way. if I want to bring your name up for any reason, I will do it. this has nothing to do with your perma ban. you got yourself into the position all by yourself, and nobody else. do us all a favor and do what you have been claiming for years and be done with all of this. “we are phasing out” “I’m done with this” ” we will be moving on to other things” this forum will be permanently closed in January, March, August, part will be visible to the public, this forum will remain open? WTF???? do you shop like this? buy it, take it back, buy it etc.
I like the fact of Bruce bringing up the play about Cooper and then your little movie deal pops up? you claim they know all about “us” but you fail to show any real proof? what does it matter if they are against us? put up, or shut up..
One other thing. I was wondering why you banned James D Godsey. He’s trying to join the AB Forum now. Should I let him in or not? I held up his registration and sent him a questioning email. I don’t let people spoof our site with false identities. Anonymous is one thing. Spoofing is another. I notice you get a lot of those over there. This is the advantage of screening people a bit. I don’t have to deal with the posts they would make. Like your guy who claimed he was going to visit Skipp Porteous, and that they were making a TV show starring Kenny and all the suspects. That was funny.
We have exactly 17 members to date. I know all of them but one. Some are family members of KC. Others I know more personally. We get between 60-100 guest visits a day. Very little maintanance required. I don’t have to deal with BS and Vortex stuff. For the most part, people just visit to get updates. They aren’t really into the discussion thing. If you haven’t noticed, it reads more like a news site, than a discussion forum. Sometimes people send me an email related to something or other they saw at the site, but it’s not really a discussion forum. That is YOUR place, and you can have that job. It’s interesting, but more than I would want to deal with. The AB Forum is where you go when you want EVERYTHING that’s going on in the Cooper case, and honest stuff at WordPress, or on video. Not what someone decides you should see. (*smiles*)
Anyway…what about this Godsey guy? You banned him. Why did you do that? Think I should reject his registration? I put it in limbo for now.
Look, I question EVERYTHING in the Cooper case. You don’t seem to like that. Now you’re upset I sent a message to Ayn Dietrich regarding the ‘Troy B’ evidence. While you’re fretting and worrying over everything I do and arguing about particles, I’m actually making serious progress. The reason I don’t make everything publicly available is because frankly…I don’t trust you and some of your members. It’s as simple as that. For example, if I told you privately who Troy B really is, you guys would be hounding him at his house, maybe even get him fired. I made a promise to him that I wouldn’t reveal his identity except if the FBI asks. He knows I would have to do that if they requested his identity.
I never said the film production company was against you. I said they had been to the DBC Forum and they were put off by two things. First, the constant negativity with my name attached to it. Second, that the public cannot view anything you guys link to, or attach to posts. I don’t even think Dropzone did that, and if you’re trying to interest the public in Cooper, that’s pretty damn dumb, in my opinion.
I was ready to phase out Cooper, but then the film deal came along. I also saw your post on what happens when this occurs. I think you got that from Writers Digest, but you were exactly right. That was pretty much the deal we signed, except I get an additional $15,000 fee on the side as a co-producer, should they actually make the picture.
The first time I contacted the FBI about ‘Troy B’ was just hypothetical. I got a pat response. I didn’t name the FBI agent, for example. This time I did. You think it’s easy to go at them like that? Ha. Bet none of you have the guts to do it.
I do have to answer Shutter’s comment back there:
“you make claims like the media doesn’t care about us after reading the thread, really? 4 members from my forum were on a national television show, and the best evidence in years in regards to the Cooper case was uncovered by Tom Kaye? you try and discredit me and my forum constantly , then turn around and do the same thing you whine about, like closing the public out. you tried closing your forum “permanently” in January only to reopen it days later, now once again you are “permanently” closing it again? I also failed to see you in the credits on Expedition Unknown?
Much like tying up the thread as you did on the DZ, as well as here you started the same crap with emails, so I blocked you. this is not bragging, it’s called necessary! I am not obligated to report anything about you. you whine either way. if I want to bring your name up for any reason, I will do it.”
Pointing out flaws and negativity isn’t whining. It’s presenting the facts. I’ll assume you mean my listed points about the DBC Forum that I posted recently. Didn’t see any whining or lies in it. I saw a lot of backslapping posts at your place last year about Ariel, and how happy you all were when the situation went to hell. Then you said you would help Bryan. All you did really was trash his best chance to re-open. I hold YOU personally responsible for that. Not for all of it, but PART of it, yes. The day after the party, I went home to Auburn and Gayla told me my mother had said ‘Yes’ to drawing from the trust fund. We were REALLY happy. I started running up a proposal to Bryan offering to finance the repairs and the reopening…under certain conditions, such as we would pay most contractors and vendors directly, and not just hand Bryan a blank check. Woo hoo! This was going to be fun. Then Bryan keeps our expensive donations, tells us to go to hell. You take over and a few weeks later…you did a big crash and burn and gave up. You should have supported our efforts from the start. I saw you and Georger’s nasty posts only the day before the party. Pfft. You never cared about Bryan or the Store. You just didn’t like it WE were helping him. Nice going.
I didn’t say the media ‘didn’t care’ about you. I said I occasionally get an email from a media type and sometimes they complain your site makes no sense unless they register first. Can’t see any links you guys point people to…can’t see any pictures unless they are permanent party on the website. This has nothing to do with me personally. Imagine Dropzone where links and pictures say, “Guests are not allowed to view links. Register or login.” Well, that might have the result of people just going elsewhere. I wouldn’t do that myself, but that’s your business.
I know four of your members were on the television show. Yes, I know AB wasn’t in the credits. Once I saw the show, and their ridiculous theory that Cooper jumped over Reno, I didn’t really want to be associated with the show anyway. It was Cooper 101 Dumbness. They didn’t even check the testimony of Rataczak and ignored the airstairs indicator light evidence, which was obvious. I know you guys didn’t hold much with that part of the show, either. You’ve said so.
It’s true I have gone around with the AB staff regarding the website. Close or not? All of it, or some of it? When? We decided it wasn’t cool for people to try and visit and just land on that page that says you have to login to see anything. So we decided to take the middle ground. People can still reach the homepage as usual, but a few threads will no longer be available to guests. That’s all. If people want full access, they can join. I’m leaving a lot up, though. A couple of guest threads, the DB Cooper Hotlinks page, and the Full List of Suspects page. And a public updates page.
Oh…I let the guy mentioned join the site. I know him anyway, but I didn’t recognize his name. Asked him who he was. He told me. Aha…I know him from Facebook and Twitter. Your place is not bad. I never said it was bad. But it’s not really a public discussion site on Cooper. Not because you banned me. But because guests can hardly make sense of the place. Have you ever logged out and taken a look at your own site? You and your members are constantly posting up links and pictures and evidence pointing here and there…but only YOU and your members can any of it. Imagine if Dropzone worked like that. They wouldn’t have received the tons of traffic they did.
First off Mr. Blevins, a disclaimer: If you are trying to talk a little smack to me over the Falcons loss, save your breath. I am not, nor have I ever claimed to be a fan of the Falcons. I’ve had one team that I pull for since I was a young kid, and that team is the Dallas Cowboys.
Second, while it may seem trivial to talk about football on a topic about DB Cooper, it has presented a unique opportunity. You made a statement a few posts ago that serves as a great example of your research abilities. You said:
“The record for teams coming back in ANY NFL postseason game from a deficit of 19 points or more is 0-93. That’s right. Never in the history of postseason NFL football had ANY team come back to win after being down nineteen points or more. (Patriots were down by 25 at one point)”
That statement is FALSE. I have to ask, have you never heard of the game simply referred to as “The Comeback”?? (Hint: it was a 32 point comeback)
There have been a total of 3 comebacks in the post season of the NFL era of at least 19 points. Drop down to 18 points and you’ll find 3 more.
Great research dude. No wonder you think Kenny is Cooper, lol.
Also, just so you know, Godsey’s a prick.
No, I didn’t research the stats. It was mentioned a couple of times by the announcers during the Super Bowl. I was working on my computer during the game, with the game going on a TV nearby. Okay…you are right…I stand corrected on that. But that has nothing to do with my research on the Cooper case.
We have a great deal of evidence against KC and Geestman. More than you know. Some I have withheld publicly as a control. Most I have released publicly. One of the most damning pieces of evidence that KC was involved is the testimony from Geestman’s niece, and some from other members of his family. The ‘sticks wrapped in red plastic’ is just TOO much to be coincidence. Have you ever heard the dynamite sticks described like that before? I certainly have not. The only two people who have EVER said that were these people:
1) FBI Agent Tom Manning out of Longview, who told the Cowlitz County Sheriff the morning after the hijacking. It’s in the Sheriff’s notebook. (I have recently been in contact with the guy who currently owns the notebook. I told him we should get together and I would like to see the whole thing and get still shots.)
2) Geestman’s niece, who said Kenny was using red electrical tape and taking filled, quarter-sized coin rolls and taping them end to end in twos. Then attaching to them using the same tape.
But I’m not here to argue those points. Or try uselessly to convince you we really ARE onto these guys. That would be a waste of time, since you rejected him years ago, and believe I just made everything up. Which I did NOT, by the way. Our view here is that so much negativity has been aimed at me personally and others involved in the investigation, that to suddenly admit we might have something, would be for some members of the DBC Forum trying to swallow a golf bar.
I’ve come to the point where I don’t give a hoot whether you believe the evidence or not. One thing the upcoming picture will do is to drive the witnesses out of the woodwork. Just like the book, but much more effectively. Geestman’s family by now, I am sure…knows the whole truth on what happened. But Bernie is family, and the niece told me they really don’t want to go public yet. I told them…go to People Magazine or something…you don’t have to talk to me. It’s too bad some of you weren’t there when I interviewed some of his family for an hour and a half at that restaurant. It was a real eye-opener. They have no objections to the movie, either. That I know.
Go to Facebook. Look up Buddy Levy, Christine McKinley, and Scott Rolle from Decoded. They all have pages there. Ask them NOW about Bernie Geestman and see what they say. It won’t be what they said on the show. And these are some very smart people. When they found out Geestman lied when he said he was at Kenny’s deathbed, and then tossed Kenny under the bus on the show when he knew full well he was with Kenny that whole week? Hmm. They’ve also seen all the additional evidence that came out after the show. I kept them updated. They now believe Geestman was probably involved in the hijacking, and they know he lied to them.
Can we go to a less-hostile, perhaps funnier note here? The film producers ordered a hundred copies of the Blast book today. And they sent me a modest check for the first year’s option payment, and another one for $410 to obtain 100 copies of Blast. (That includes the shipping.) Anyway….they are putting together these cute promo packages for distribution to certain actors and directors to tempt them to come on board for the film. And here’s what they did:
They got themselves a bunch of small briefcases from Amazon. A whole bunch of them. Inside go the following items: The book of course. A pair of sunglasses. A ten-page treatment of the book and how they want to present Kenny and Bernie’s story on film. Some key pictures, or pictures of documents in 8×10 glossy. A few other things, some they haven’t decided on yet. I did not know producers did this sort of thing, but they told me yes…sometimes.
Now that is funny. I will probably ask them for one.
‘attaching CUT WIRES to them using the same tape…’ (correction)
Correction: Golf BALL, (not ‘bar’) One thing you can count on from me. I may make mistakes occasionally, but I do give it to people straight, and I’m not afraid to lay issues and evidence out there publicly.
This has the effect of people either hating you for doing so, or respecting you for the same reason.
I can live with that.
I’ve read nothing in the FBI files where anyone who saw the bomb says that it was wrapped in red plastic. I don’t think it’s in there. So, you find some other source who says something a little different and you go with that. That’s what is wrong with you little theory.
By the way, there is a little difference between wrapped in red tape and wrapped in red plastic.
Also, just curious, does all these copies of the book that you just sold say that Kenny bought his house with cash or has that been corrected?
Nah. I didn’t correct it in the paperback version. It doesn’t matter anymore. The house purchase is not really the important evidence, although I think it’s funny that the mortgage Kenny assumed was held by the same folks who paid off the hijacking ransom. There’s something ironic about it. Most of the film’s script will be done using the report we sent the FBI in 2015, with some additions. It’s early in the process, and I am not sure how they will present the story. I think they’re going to start fairly early in Kenny’s life, or at least just before he joined the Army. They’re still working on the treatment. The contract was only certified last Monday, so as I said, it’s early.
You say this:
“I’ve read nothing in the FBI files where anyone who saw the bomb says that it was wrapped in red plastic. I don’t think it’s in there. So, you find some other source who says something a little different and you go with that. That’s what is wrong with you little theory.
By the way, there is a little difference between wrapped in red tape and wrapped in red plastic.”
You’re right. There is NOTHING in the FBI files about it. My personal belief is that this is one of the details they hold back to verify someone’s story, a confessor perhaps. For example, you confess to the hijacking. The FBI asks: ‘How did you make the bomb?’ REPLY: ‘I used road flares with wires and a battery.’ FBI says: ‘You ain’t Cooper.’
I tell people sometimes, ‘You had to be there.’ Here is an example. I’m sitting there listening to this rather ordinary lady with three sons and a nice daughter telling me about this incident with Kenny in the shed, the red tape, the coin rolls, the wires. She wasn’t lying. And she no reason to lie. She wasn’t trying to profit from any of it, or impress me. She was just relating what she saw, in a very sincere and straightforward fashion. She was a little embarassed about it. Bernie’s appearance on Decoded was a complete surprise to the whole family. He hadn’t told anyone he would be on the show. They only watched it because Kenny was shown in the trailer for the show, and some of them knew Kenny. So they watched the show. Surprise. Their uncle is on there, and lying to the cast.
It comes down to credibility. I examined the niece’s story, her demeanor, her history. I decided she was telling the truth. I told her People Magazine might pay her family a lot of money for their story. She rejected that totally. When I interviewed them, I also gave them a preliminary copy of the FBI report to take home with them. They contacted me later with more information, some of which I have kept confidential to everyone except KC’s family, Greg and Gayla, and the film producers.
Then I see these entries in the Sheriff’s notebook later that give a very similar story. Wrapped in red plastic. Wrapped in red plastic tape? What’s the difference? The stew said: Red sticks. She didn’t say, ‘Wrapped in red cellophane.’ Or ‘wrapped in red Saran Wrap’. Way too much for coincidence, and as you said, not in the FBI files. Yet there it is.
Some people at the DB Cooper Forum forget something. Even though, like Geoff Gray did, we went along with the cash for the house idea, it was just like a couple of other things along the way. In such a complex investigation, with so many people interviewed, so many involved, you are going to make the occasional misstep. You find out you’re wrong on something? Okay, get to the truth…and move on. That book was published more than six years ago. We found out a lot more about Kenny and Bernie since that time. I am perfectly convinced that Kenneth P. Christiansen was indeed Cooper, and Bernard Wayne Geestman of Port Angeles, WA the guy who helped him. And I am going with that. Not because I care about what a few people at the DBC Forum believe, but because I think that’s exactly what happened.
I have pretty straight-up with people about this whole thing. But a lot of the time, people at the DBC Forum just ignored what I told them all along. For example, Shutter harping on about how the FBI dismissed Christiansen as a suspect. I showed him the emails from the FBI saying otherwise. Sure…they wrote him off at first, in early 2008 after the Geoff Gray article. Too much experience they said. Didn’t quite fit the description. Four years later, they’re telling me “Some in the office (Seattle FBI) think he’s a good suspect. Others believe there are better suspects.” So that told me that SOME people at the FBI thought we might be right.
If they make the film, one thing is absolutely assured. I am convinced of it. The truth WILL come out and not a whole long time after the film is released. You guys should be HAPPY, not confrontational about it. What are you worried about? That we might be right? Well…that would be a problem, wouldn’t it. All that negativity, all those personal attacks, the crap at WordPress, whatever. All for nothing, and swallowing a golf ball would be easier. But because of all the name-calling, and the attacks, the negativity, I don’t feel sorry for any of you. As much as I have argued with some of you in the case, I have NEVER used a false identity to attack you. I always came at you straight up and told you what I thought. Not like Georger, or Shutter and his nasty emails that end with, “Don’t bother to answer this because I blocked your email address.” Kind of childish, don’t you think?
I don’t know if come off as stupid with people, but I can assure you I am not. And when people lie to me, I’m going to find out why, and then what motivated them to lie. Because beyond THAT is where the truth is. On the other hand, it might come out that Kenny and Bernie DIDN’T do it. Either way, it’s going to come out. That’s been my only interest in the case. Anything else is baloney and a waste of my time.
Now that you mentioned it, I may make a few changes to the book. It will take a bit of time because you have to get it right the first time. There have been zero revisions so far. Every time you submit a new file to Lightning Source/Ingram for updates, it costs $75. Maybe now it’s time to go ahead and drop the money on them for this. Changing Kindle is free.
One last point, because frankly, I’m tired of hearing about it from some members of the DBC Forum. They say…”He argues with himself. There are no members” etc about the AB Forum.
We have a mere 18 members. That’s it. Not too many. Guest visits run from 60-120 on average each day. Few people post or actually join. On the other hand, I have an article out there titled ‘Ten Good Reasons to Stop Executing People in the United States. On Newsvine. I dropped Google tracking code when views went over a half-million, and that was years ago. Only 63 comments to the article I think, but it’s probably been seen by millions.
Here’s the point of all that: The DBC Forum is a more-or-less closed group where links and pictures to anything cannot be seen by the public unless they take the time to register. Okay, fine. And it’s basically a discussion and informational site on the Cooper case.
The AB Forum is nothing like that. I don’t even encourage people to post much. I would just have to moderate more. It’s a wide-open informational site on Cooper where little, if anything, is restricted to members. At least right now. You guys are the discussion folks. We’re the ‘Here’s Stuff on KC and the Cooper Case in General’ folks. People drop by and look, read, maybe download something. That’s about it and it works for me. Comparing the two sites is like comparing apples to oranges. One reason why most people don’t register is they don’t need to register. Everything is open to them anyway.
Interesting. You’ve known for quite a while that Kenny didn’t buy his home with cash, yet you still sell a book that says otherwise. You’ve never bothered to change what is a known lie in the Kenny myth. But now you may change it, since I mentioned it. Like it never occurred to you that you shouldn’t keep spreading lies.
Speaking of lies, something is only a lie if you know it not to be true. So, if Bernie has no memory of where he was and who he was with during the hijacking, then he’s not really lying. I think it is preposterous that you would expect Bernie, or anyone, to be able to remember who they were with at an exact moment in time that long ago.
And don’t give me that bullshit that everyone remembers what they were doing when the hijacking was going on. That is simply bullshit and you know it.
I don’t recall ever asking Geestman where he was at the time of the hijacking. Obviously, you never read the interview I did with him. When Decoded asked him that question, he sat there looking at them in silence. He never said a word. He did that on several questions. He would just sit there looking at them until the director said ‘cut’. Why aren’t you sending the same nasty message as your comment above to Geoff Gray, who was saying that about the house in the New York Magazine article more than 18 months before our investigation ever started? You should be telling HIM this stuff, since he is the one responsible for creating that myth, not me. Both Skipp and I questioned the accuracy of the article, and Gray said it was good. So on that particular point, knowing that Gray had once worked for the prestigious New York Times as a sports reporter, we believed him.
How I found out where Geestman REALLY was that Thanksgiving was through the witnesses. His ex-wife, his good family friend Helen Jones, his niece, and others. Jones and Margie Geestman had not contacted each in more than ten years, yet they gave the same story.
Bruce Smith has some inaccuracies in his book as well. Gunther, and others. Even Gray, whose book AND article continue to claim the house was sold for cash. And this will be the 10th year you can link to that article. And his book is still out there with the same inaccurate information, yet you never mention him, even though he was the one who claimed that initially, not ME. Unlike Gray, I corrected this assumption in the FBI report, in the video on YouTube, and in inquiries by email and public internet postings. The YouTube video alone has had more views than the total number of booksales for Blast. Gray did not do any of these things. In fact, in the YouTube video I tell people that ‘at first we thought the house was bought for cash…’ and then I go on to telling them how it really happened. So I would say we do make serious efforts to get the truth out there whenever possible. Has Gray ever done that? NO.
None of the books on Cooper are totally accurate. Not one, but ours is closest to the truth, and with the additions of the FBI report, (which can be freely downloaded) and the video, we strived to present the most accurate evidence possible. No one thing alone points to KC and Geestman’s guilt. It is a combination package, for sure.
Our book has a disclaimer at the end regarding some of these things, and the reason why is because back in December 2010, we just didn’t HAVE all the answers. I had warned Skipp Porteous that the book was incomplete, possibly inaccurate in parts, although I was pretty good with the basic premise of it….that Kenny was Cooper and Geestman helped him. The book and the Decoded show served two very good purposes. It laid out the basic case against these men, and drove additional witnesses and information out of the woodwook. That’s how we found out the rest of the story. In fact, one of the first things you read in the report, at the end of the introduction letter is this: “Between the book published on Christiansen, and the report, the report should be considered the more accurate source…’ That’s because the report contains information and corrections from the original book. When people email me about the book, I often update them on the house information as well. And yes…I tell them the house was bought basically HALF for cash on that promissory note, and the rest done by Kenny assuming the other half on a mortgage from SeaFirst Bank. And even though Geestman tried to claim he knew nothing about the arrangements on the house sale, we showed how the owners knew him very well (Geestman served as Best Man at the Grimes’ wedding) and that he probably put Kenny and the Grimes couple together in the first place. Why else would the Grimes trust Kenny for half a house on a $7,500 promissory note. His word alone? By presenting his recent pay stubs showing he made a paltry $512 a month before taxes and could afford to pay not only the mortgage, but THEM as well? No. We believe Geestman lied and told the Grimes that Kenny, working for the airline, made good money and could pay them off, no problem. Which he could not…on his own money. So how did he do it? The Grimes’ son said ‘no way’ would his dad wait long for his money. He was certain on that point.
I didn’t REALLY decide to update the book just because you made a mention about the house sale. I decided to do it because I want to add the most recent information. ALL of it, not just one point on the house. The testimony of the niece, the signing of the option for the upcoming film, and a few other things. If I updated that book every time I found out something else about Kenny and Bernie, it would cost me $75 each time I did, and the bill would be quite high by now. But…I think now is the right time. Whether one point in that book is inaccurate is reletively moot. We don’t base much of the case against those two on the house, but on the other evidence. And like I said, I DO strive hard to keep updated with the latest information.
Over at the DB Cooper Forum, I often see posts that ignore a lot of that and keep spouting things that are inaccurate about our most current information about the case. This is what happens when you don’t stay updated, and you don’t go to the source and ask. About the only place any of you ever asked me anything in years….is here on Bruce’s blog. Try an email once in a while like others do. You’ll get better results.
ParrotVol says in part:
“And don’t give me that bullshit that everyone remembers what they were doing when the hijacking was going on. That is simply bullshit and you know it…”
Not at all. And the reason is that memories can be very good when you have a context to them. Some examples: Most people, if they are the right age for it, can remember EXACTLY what they were doing when they first got word that JFK had been shot in Dallas. I was in fourth grade, in Catholic School in Roseburg, OR. Mother Superior walks in, gives us the news. Everyone starts crying, and they had the school attend an immediate Mass. Then after the Mass, when word came the President was dead, we were all sent home.
Or, if you’re from the Northwest, what you were doing and where you were when Mt. St. Helens exploded. I was at Everett Community College that day, and even up there we got a slight dusting. I can even tell what class I was in that day, which wasn’t a REAL class…I was spinning records for the college radio station.
Or even Cooper. I was a sophomore at Sumner High School. I was getting home to the farm and got the word on the TV. All three main stations went to a news feed from SeaTac. The whole state was probably watching. It was the biggest thing to happen in the Northwest for God knows how long. The drama on the tarmac, the misty rain outside, (no big storm, I assure you) and wondering what would happen to the hijacker.
You are wrong on this. When there is a big context to draw from in memories, results can stay with you for life. Ask anyone who participated in D-Day, or any other event that would create a solid memory that lasts them for life. Geestman’s ex-wife and Helen Jones had no problem remembering where they were, what they were doing, and how they got word about the hijacking. They listened to it on the radio, Jones said.
You changed your youtube video as a result of me pointing it out on the DZ that it hadn’t been changed. It seems you tend to let things like that go until someone challenges you on them.
And No, you are wrong. Just because you may remember who you were with and what you were doing during Norjack, does not mean everyone does. To compare that to the Kennedy assassination, which was a much more tragic and historical event, is laughable.
Finally, how many people actually saw Kenny and Bernie together on the weekend of the hijacking?
Oh, pulllleeze…get real if you don’t mind. How in the hell could I ‘change’ the video? Did you even view more than the first minute or two? That video was filmed last summer twenty miles off the main road in the Olympic Mountains. I would have to go back up there in the WINTER (that’s like…NOW) in order to change it just for you. LOL. No, I’m afraid it’s the original video.
What you said there was actually funny. Plus…the turnoff from main road…distance to my house is about an hour and a half. No, I don’t think I would go through all of that just for you, and change the weather to boot.
Come on, now. It’s the same video it’s always been. That’s obvious. And you didn’t answer my question, either. It is THIS: How come you are not ragging on Geoff Gray, since he is the one who created the myth of Kenny and the house for cash? Why not? Why do you come to me? I’m the one who made public changes enmasse letting people know the truth on that. I’m the one updating his book with the correct info. I’m the one who has already updated all information in a 54-page report to the Seattle FBI. I’m also the one who made sure the facts were presented correctly in a heavily-viewed video on Christiansen and Geestman. I’m doing the right thing here. You are doing the WRONG thing by coming to me. You should be talking to Geoff Gray, the New York Magazine, and Crown Books, who will perpetuate that myth about the house from now until forever. And if people want the straight story, they will come to me for it. And many have already.
I’m sorry we differ about contexts and memories. I don’t think you understand the nature of conciousness in the Northwest regarding the hijacking. If you were FROM the Northwest, this would be easier to explain. Most people, if they are old enough, and they are FROM the Northwest, are going to recall where they were and what they were doing when the hijacking occurred. I have seen a couple of people say the same thing, including Meyer Louie, I believe. It ain’t rocket science. It was a very big deal when it happened. That’s why Cooper is a legend here, and why they wrote songs about him, and why whenever a shred of evidence or another news article turned up in a paper here…everyone read it. You have no clue about this. He’s like Bigfoot here. I shouldn’t be having to tell you this stuff, either. You’re not using common sense. You’re letting your obvious dislike for me get in the way of the facts.
Do you know where you were and what you were doing on the morning of 9-11 when the second plane went into the tower? Yes, that incident was worse than Cooper. But Cooper was almost as big HERE, but it was more localized. Why don’t you come to Washington State and ask anyone here who is a lifelong resident and of the proper age, where they were and what they were doing when Cooper hijacked that plane. Most people will be able to tell you.
No. I didn’t change the video. If anyone actually saw Kenny and Bernie together that weekend, I would have said so by now. We know they were together. We know they went (at least intially) to Geestman’s shop and property in Oakville, WA. After that, well…you’ve heard it all before.
You guys over there at the Cooper Forum are just pissed off they’re making the movie on Kenny. If you really don’t think we got it right on those two, you should be happy, not pissed. If they end up actually releasing such a picture, the truth will come out one way or another on those two. And quickly. Get over it.
Correction: Video was not filmed LAST summer. It was filmed over the period of June 19-22, 2015 and uploaded three days later after I returned from the Olympics. Same as it ever was, which means we’ve been crushing that myth on the house for over 18 months now. Why don’t you complain now to Geoff Gray? He’s the originator of that myth. Not me.
I think I should probably explain something here.
First, I am not COMPLETELY convinced Kenny and Bernie were the perps on the Cooper hijacking.
However, the film production company execs have told me that THEY ARE. I tried my little caveat with them and it didn’t work. They said they had been investigating my work for over a year. They also did a little checking on their own. I cannot change their minds, and even if I could, I don’t think I would want to. I think it’s important that Kenny and Bernie’s story be presented this way.
Sure, I won’t lie to you. It’s true I would quite happy to cash their checks. But I have previously turned down another offer, plus the TV stuff, for which I took nothing. This time is different because the producers want to shoot the film without embellishing the story beyond what I have now. No comedy, no ‘maybe they did it and we’re going to leave you hanging about it at the end’ stuff. Just a straight presentation. That’s why I said yes. And because I know that such a film will bring out the truth, even if turns out we’re wrong…that will come out as well.
I have to tell you, though. I don’t think we’re wrong. Some key evidence will be presented in the film that I have not ever made public. Geestman’s family is aware of all this, since I keep them updated. They have no objections, and neither does Kenny’s family.
We are obviously talking about two different videos. There was a video on youtube that you never changed, once the truth about the house was learned, until I called you out on it. I think it may have been the top reasons Kenny is Cooper video or something. But there was a video that you let stay on youtube, with false information, until you got called out. This is all on DZ if you care to go back and take a look. Now you’re doing the same with the book. I called your ass out on it, so now you’re going to change it. You would never have bothered to change it otherwise.
Then you say, ” I’m the one who made public changes enmasse letting people know the truth on that.” Again, you made changes after someone else did the research to learn the truth (something you should have done), and then called you out for not updating your story.
As far as Grey goes, he did not invent the lie on the house. We both know that could have come from only one place and that is Lyle, the inventor. He invented it to help sell the story. Grey isn’t out here pushing Kenny as the hijacker and does not believe Kenny to be the hijacker. I’ve never had any communication with Grey, but I may just drop him an email and see if he has made any adjustments or plans to.
And I’ll let you in on a little secret. I have in-laws that grew up in the Northwest. They remember when the hijacking happened but can’t even begin to recall any details about what they were doing or who they were with. This is simply the way it is. But that don’t work for you. You need for everyone in the Northwest at the time to have amazing recollection of that time. Because if they don’t, then Bernie may not recall where he was or who he was with.
No one saw them together. So how do we know they were together? People who didn’t see them together, say they were together, that’s how. They remember that 40 years ago, Bernie and Kenny were together, but no one saw them together. Interesting indeed.
Okay….I was getting a bit miffed at you, I’ll admit. Now I see you’re just uninformed. But that’s common when people don’t go to the source. You’ve been buying into all the hype by Shutter and Georger and others at the DBC Forum, that’s all. They say I lied about everything, just made it all up on the witnesses and their testimony, blah blah blah. Seen that, done that. That’s why I made the unedted version of the Seattle FBI report a public download. I figured…well, contact them yourself if you want. Maybe they’ll talk to you, in other words. The only thing I edited out was Decoded cast member Scott Rolle’s cell phone number.
First, Lyle lives in Morris, Minnesota and doesn’t even know who Bernie Geestman is. Second, it wasn’t Lyle who either made up or got it wrong on how Kenny acquired the house. That was Geoff Gray, whether you like hearing it or not. Third, it was TWO people who discovered the truth on that. Shutter gets credit for finding the transaction document out of Pierce County, and I found out about the promissory note after Shutter broke that information, by hunting down And and Joe Grimes’ boy and interviewing him down by Oakville.
It was a complete surprise to both me and Skipp when this happened. We trusted that Gray’s research on the house was solid, the work he did for his initial article. The guy had worked for the New York Times, for crying out loud. It never even occurred to me that he could be wrong on that until Shutter brought it up. But Shutter did not have the whole story, although he was the first to figure out Gray was wrong.
Gray’s book starts out with Kenny and he goes heavily into investigating him in the book. He also got angry with Himmelsbach when H told him that ‘airline employees were head and shoulders above ordinary Americans and would never do such a thing…’ (When he interviewed Himmelsbach) because Gray wasn’t buying that philosophy…i.e. that there were no criminals in the airline business. He just couldn’t reach a conclusion in his book on Kenny, and as I said in the 2015 video, one big reason is that Skipp Porteous was not cooperating with Gray when they were both writing their books. If I had known this, I would have kept Gray updated. But Porteous was supposedly the liaison here. Back in 2009-10, I didn’t even know how to get hold of Gray. He had not yet put up that Cooper website and I couldn’t find an email for him.
After Gray’s book came out, I realized while I was reading it that Gray had no idea who people like Helen Jones, Margie Geestman, Bernie Geestman and family even were. I called out Porteous on this. He admitted he had kept everything his PI company had discovered a secret from Gray. Since then, Porteous has expressed regret for doing that, saying it would have been better if we had shared information and worked together. Author jealousy, I suppose. Later, when Porteous got sick (he has aphasia now) and could hardly put two words together on a keyboard anymore…it was left to me to keep going and get to the truth.
I do recall writing an article or maybe doing a video called ‘Twenty-Five Best Reasons Why…’ etc on Kenny. And since we now know the REAL arrangements on the house, it’s no surprise I pulled the video from YouTube. Yes, I would have done that. However, it isn’t like I kept perpetuating the myth after Shutter (first) and later yours truly, found out the truth. I think the 2015 video lays out the best information currently available on Kenny and Bernie though, and that’s what counts.
As far as some witnesses I interviewed remembering where they were and what they were doing over the dates of the hijacking…well, that’s just the way it was. I don’t know what you want from me about that. Sure…I remembered what happened that day. Meyer Louie, same thing I believe. Maybe some people don’t, okay. People I talked to certainly did, so I sat there and listened and took notes. One reason they probably did is most of them (at the time) only lived a short drive from SeaTac Airport. Cooper is One Big Deal here in the Puget Sound area. He’s history. He’s in the same league as Bigfoot. He’s bigger than you think. We get a lot of book sales out of Europe, and especially Great Britain, even today. And the hits (email inquiries about the case, or Kenny) just keep on comin’.
You know, as far as this upcoming film goes, I did make efforts to have some of you participate in the process if you wanted to. I made approaches to Bruce, but he wasn’t interested I guess, because he didn’t answer the emails. And Shutter didn’t want you guys over at the DBC Forum to even know what was going on. That’s not my fault. The producers didn’t say they ‘hated’ his website. They said they couldn’t make sense of it. Try going there as a guest (logging out first) and see what everyone else sees. Every single link, every single picture or piece of evidence, or article, or video you guys point people to…cannot not be seen unless you are a registered member. So most of the time the posts don’t make much sense. You are not reaching the public very well doing this. But that’s Shutter’s business I suppose.
Look…there are no guarantees they will make the movie. It’s always a crap shoot. “The waiting is the hardest part…” as Tom Petty said. If they do…the truth will come out of KC and Bernie pretty darn quickly afterward. And it’s going to be the first (serious) feature film on the hijacking. This is a good thing for Cooper fans, not a bad thing. Wouldn’t you like to know the truth on these two? I certainly would.
Correction: “the truth will come out ‘ON’ KC and Bernie pretty darn quickly afterward.
I think this Q and A stuff on Bruce’s news site has to stop. So if anyone has any further questions, they can use the new Guest Thread at the AB Forum. Registration isn’t necessary to post, and unlike here…u can edit your stuff if you make an error.
” Wouldn’t you like to know the truth on these two? I certainly would” – RMB
I already know the truth on those two. So does everyone else.
That’s funny. Define ‘everyone else’. You mean your little group at the DBC? I’m afraid there are many others who don’t share your rather narrow view on the situation. Including the three top execs at a certain film production company in Los Angeles. And the vast majority of messages I receive from people who have read the book, or downloaded the FBI report on KC, are positive and supportive. You’ve been listening to too much hype too from people who have a built-in motivation to deny the evidence. People whose entire website would not only look foolish, but serve little purpose anymore if KC and Geestman turn out to be just what we said they were.
I have no such problem. The book on KC is just the ONE book. I’ve written several others and none of them have a thing to do with the Cooper case. With two more coming out this summer. If if turned out we were wrong, AB of Seattle would certainly continue anyway.
However, it’s true you have a right to your opinion. Okay…you think we got it wrong about KC and Geestman. I will accept that. Just know that in reality…it is you and yours who are now in the minority opinion. You are fooling yourself if you believe otherwise.
Face it. Your friends (you and Bruce Smith excluded) played every dirty trick in the book, called me every name possible, insulted Gayla and the AB staff, even sacrificed the best chance for the Ariel Store to reopen in their cheap efforts to discredit at any cost. They may have put the nail in the coffin of the biggest symbol of DB Cooper in the Northwest. They didn’t like it that I was helping Bryan, so they made sure that ended. Now Bryan is left without support, since Shutter, who talked a big game for months saying that HIS site could do something to help, but ‘not if Blevins was involved,’ gave up that effort within a few weeks. Now the store will probably never reopen. That was done simply out of spite, and because they didn’t like it we were trying to help Bryan. These are the people you call ‘friends’. Did you know that Shutter and Georger were making negative comments about the fundraiser at the DBC Forum right up to the day before it happened? Nice people you hang with over there. They are as phony as a pink three-dollar bill.
I have no respect for such people, and their opinions on Kenny Christiansen’s guilt or innocence mean zip to me.
You Robt Belvins would say a red bird was a blue bird…
What we have FOUND on Duane is mind boggling…the Modulus you mentioned there are lots of them and they have NOTHING to do with the Modulus Corp of 1960’s. You better get your research GUNS out again…YOU do not have a clue where to look!
I have NO interests in spending my time with the biggest NaySayer in history of Cooper and with the one man who STOLE information and made up things about a nice guy – Kenny. Kenny was well liked and he had friends – IF you had any brains at all – you would KNOW that Kenny was NOT Cooper.
Good Luck with your book of Lies!
BYE!
NOW I KNOW WHY NO ONE COMES HERE – IT IS THE ROBERT BLEVINS SHOW!
Plenty of people come here, Jo. You gave the proper information from Modulus Corp. I simply looked them up on Google using exact search. Duane could not have worked for them more than two years before they were actually created. Why don’t you snap a photo of those W-2’s you said you had, and then post them. Then I will admit I was wrong and stand corrected.
The evidence we’ve gathered since mid-2009 shows a very good possibility that Kenny could indeed be Cooper. And Geestman the guy who not only helped him, but may have helped motivate Kenny to do what he did. Virtually the ONLY people who are not supporting us on the current evidence, (some of which has not been made public as a control) are a few folks at the DBC Forum.
Their reasons for doing this are simple. Fear. And the idea that after investigating so much negativity, that they would be made to look like fools. ‘DB Cooper Experts,’ my eye. They don’t want to know who did it. They just don’t want it to be me who discovered the truth, the Johnny-Come-Lately they spent so much time going after. It’s obvious to practically everyone except them. Even if Geestman came forward and gave a full confession with details, they would refuse to believe it. But that is the way they are. I have accepted that.
Correction: “And the idea that after INVESTING so much negativity, that they would be made to look like fools.” Sorry about that.
The DBC Forum and I are never going to see eye to eye. That’s a given. They do their thing, we do ours. I am satisfied with ours.
I’m going on a well-deserved vacation into the Olympic Mountains between March 16-20. Right now, this is the biggest thing on my mind, not DB Cooper. I don’t know what will happen, or the results of the upcoming picture on Christiansen’s life, but I do know that after all of that is over I am not only moving out of Washington State, but out of the DB Cooper case.
Are the tax records and employment records for the company still available to anyone.
I have done more than snapshots – and they are not for the public – only 3 individuals are privey to these at this time…and 2 others are doing MORE research…. I was packing things away when something someone said hit me and I pulled those old TAX files he kept in a metal box…odd he kept those tax reports. The FBI had made copies of these, but evidently they didn’t study them very well…..I knew I reviewed them but know the things I now know…20 yrs later I look at those old tax records – something stands out…something I questioned and in the last 20 yrs acquired the ability to research things – but, I did not go back to those old tax files until – the Citizen Sleuths started to talk about Ti – I didn’t know the connection, but the memories of the things he told me about his life – it was ALL there…and that is how I found it – I was researching TI reading anything I could find.
The TI alone was not enough – but when they named all of the other chemicals then I started to dig back into Duane’s past…..and it was right there in the tax papers…the connection to TI and other chemicals – but what I have to do now is find OLD records of that company – pictures or names of others who worked there during a 4 yr span.
ONE thing I know about the company is that they made and developed parts for Boeing and the Space vehicles – they are NO longer in business and other companies use that name Modulus,
but they are NOT the defunct inventive company of the past.
NOT going to give someone like you Blevins – any ammunition…dodged enough of that over the yrs….when this is confirmed and I have the best of the best working on the project – then and only then will they be made public. I was throwing in the towel – but not now – the FBI has some explaining to do! And they will probably be given a chance to do that on public TV – like when they put me on the TV when I went to WA and someone kept putting words in my mouth – things that were NOT true…I got up and WALKED out of the room and let Doug Pasternac take over…I was NOT going to be made to say things that were NOT true…I was NOT going to lie on a TV program. I forget the question they asked, but it was all I was going to take…when they told me HOW to answer it. I WALKED!
I have recently been quiet with my research…health and personal matters took front seat & why I was packing things away… the answer was in front of me all of this time…the things he said & told me – it was all there. Then the paper trail – that was there. Then the next trail when suddenly he has money to spend & how the hell did an ex-con become a top rated insurance salesman and manager? Ever wonder why Geestman did not contact me? Who was the woman Duane asked in 1993 – “How is Kenny doing?” Who did they come to Pensacola to see? You didn’t write the story the PI did – you engarnished it. Protect and do NO Harm! Remember that? NOT because they were part of the skyjacking – but because they pledged to protect and do no harm.
You didn’t know that Duane had quiet a history in WA and I didn’t know ALL of it until recently.
YOU refused to go look at the one place I told you to look for a picture of Weber – you made NO attempt – you didn’t want me to know where 2 certain individuals where – you are a FRAUD!
They like myself are elderly and perhaps deceased…I would be surprise if either one of them was still alive…because their being dead is the only way you can SELL your story. So how are you going to collect on a movie with your 2 featured individuals deceased? OH! that’s right you had to wail unit they were deceased before you could sell the story to a producer.
Well, let me tell you a little something about Movie Options…most of them are trashed before they even think about producing them…there is LITTLE money involved in an Option and that is all you will get is an OPTION…an option is not a contract to produce…and no money is required with an option…I didn’t ask for money – just help in the investigation & I got it. I had given up finding an answer that would prove Duane was Cooper…I knew that I had NOT lied and that I had told the truth – so many connections it was mind boggling so I decided maybe I was crazy just like others thought I was…but I wasn’t and I knew it. How did it all link? Why did Duane tell me the things he told me over the 17 yrs we spent together….why did other little things leak out that Duane had told me before he died – things that were NOT significant or specific to Cooper…just people he knew and places he had been to….I even knew about Rackstraws experiences – but he is not Cooper….but Duane knew him – so how did Duane know so many people that later in life would be mentioned in stories about Cooper…????? That was a big hurdle…it was suggested that since my story varied with suspects that I was making them up – in my mind….I did not know the connection or why or how I would know about this person or that person or why Duane would mention this person or knew that person…and had been in that area. Things never before connecting to Cooper.
Even I thought I was going mad – that maybe as had been suggested I was having false recall, but the recall was before these other characters ever present themselves or presented by others ever became known…I had written things – about individual who I didn’t know and then they come to life….am I freak who can know and see things before they happen? Not hardly!
Well, I had written in my letters to Himmelsback and in my boxes of things I wrote about these things before they became public knowledge – all dated…so how did I know these things & about certain individuals before they were ever introduced to the world of Cooperites looking for a story?
Frankly I do not know, but I do know that the PI was the catalyst…it all seems to go back to that PI!
Why?
I certainly didn’t image the copy of the plane ticket or the book of matches or the swatch of material that may have been part of the chute, a large jar of chute equipment – stripped and old, and the MOUSE which I still have – WHAT is that about? Well, I found out that Tina’s nickname was MOUSE! True or false I do not know? I never got to ask her that question. I never got to ask her if she was the little girl in a book written by a member of a church in her area – about a little girl named Tina…only 3000 printed…the writer had 2 of them and I had one…she was surprised that someone in FL contacted her – she was living in FL also. I asked her why she named the little girl Tina “Just because I liked the name”. The little girl in the book was Dutch, but tucked inside of the book was an actual picture of a little girl that looks JUST like Tina…a little girl in a catholic school outfit. Many of my question and doubts have been erased – but, who was the man who contacted me from overseas – a man who vanished and who put me in contact with Alice. Why would these things happen…I will never know who that man was in real life – he was a Swede (supposedly) on the computer at one of the site and then POOF! I have another idea of who it was – and I worry about that young man – that he might never be able to come home.
When the Government covers up things – they should be held accountable also – so let the young man come home and leave him alone.- the government wants to bring him home to punish him for what – TELLING THE TRUTH. What is wrong with this world is TOO many GOVERNMENT SECRETS.
Then there was the out & out frauds – such as one who told me about making multiple trips to WA over a short spand of time & that he had box of trinkets Duane wanted me to have. There are things that went on that I never discussed in any thread – but they happened. So where does it all END….well, one thing is for CERTAIN – Kenny was NOT Cooper!
Blevins the people working with me have absolutely NOTHING to do with any of the sites. You sure have a way of twisting the words…these guys do not go near those sites. They work from real research – not playing games on a computer for profit. I was not going to do anymore posting but it is time for someone to put you in your place…and tell the real story.
If you think that the majority of people that have a good understanding of the Cooper case support Kenny as Cooper, you are out of your mind. It isn’t a bias. I don’t believe Kenny was Cooper, simply because the evidence tells me he wasn’t. It’s that simple. Most people that consider the evidence come to the same conclusion.
“If you think that the majority of people that have a good understanding of the Cooper case support Kenny as Cooper, you are out of your mind. It isn’t a bias. I don’t believe Kenny was Cooper, simply because the evidence tells me he wasn’t. It’s that simple. Most people that consider the evidence come to the same conclusion…”
Uh, huh. Your few friends over at the DBC Forum are MORE than biased. They have shown that by their actions, their posts, their cheap efforts to squash the truth. Face it. It didn’t work.
A pathetic website that created a ‘Suspects’ page naming only ONE suspect…Kenny Christiansen…and then proceeded to amateurishly try and write him off.
A Fearless Leader (aka Shutter) who sends me emails calling me a liar and then bragging I can’t answer those emails because he blocked my email address.
Your most prolific poster, (aka Georger) who has called me more names than can be listed here.
I could go on, but you already know these things anyway. We will see what happens in the end. They may be ‘close’ to the case, but they have no interest in the truth. They are a small group of rather hateful people who are willing to sacrifice anyone or anything to make themselves feel good.
Like I said, it didn’t work. Speak for them if you wish, but don’t presume to speak for the public. Because generally, they are not with you on this one. Never assume people are dumb, or stupid, especially when you leave tracks even a blind bear could follow.
I speak for no one but myself. I’ve looked at the evidence. I’ve read your report. I’ve watched your videos and even commented on them, only to have my comments removed because they voiced an opinion that was different than yours, albeit respectfully. I’ve came to the only logical conclusion that one can come to, which is that Kenny isn’t Cooper.
You say the public agrees with you? Maybe there are some that do.But what a misinformed public believes has no bearing on the truth. But, there is certainly not a groundswell of support for Kenny. If there was, there would be some sort of presence on the internet. Much more than a member-less forum.
I’ve never heard your take on the split between Kenny and Bernard. Do you think that Kenny kept all of the money, or did he split it with the guy who was the brains of the operation???
I know that in the past you have done some editing on Wikipedia on Kenny. You must have overlooked this little nugget”
“Christiansen reportedly purchased a house with cash a few months after the hijacking”
Don’t worry though, I took care of it. It now reads:
“Christiansen was reported to have purchased a house with cash a few months after the hijacking. However, that has now been proven to be false”
I also added the word “supposedly” to the following:
While dying of cancer in 1994 he supposedly told Lyle, “There is something you should know, but I cannot tell you.”
No need to thank me, just doing my part.
You must have done that a while ago. I recently edited it to read ‘assumed mortgage, signed promissory note.’ (short version of what I actually wrote)
You can do what you wish at Wiki. I think it’s rude that you and yours over there keep using Bruce’s news blog to discuss my role in the Cooper case. Why don’t you just use the Guest Thread at the AB Forum. This isn’t a forum.
BTW: Wasn’t just Lyle at Kenny’s house when he died. Kenny’s other brother Oliver was there, as well as the couple who were taking care of Kenny.
Look, you can believe what you wish regarding Kenny and Bernie. Not everyone thinks they are guilty. Many do, some don’t. It is what it is, as the saying goes. Sorry I just won’t ‘go away’ for you folks at the DBC, but that obviously isn’t happening.
While you busy yourself altering Wiki (like who cares anyway?) you never once addressed any of the real-life issues I brought about the people you hang with at the Forum, and the damage they caused, the hatred that eats them up alive. Me? I have no such problem. Hate is a damn big word and I don’t even like the WORD.
EDIT: Looks like Wikipedia took down BOTH our entries and put them back to the original. Not sure why they did that. I had a reference link installed. What the heck. It’s Wiki.
I suggest any further comments or back-and-forth stuff be done AWAY from this site. Since I can’t visit the DBC, you can either post your questions to the Guest Thread (registration not necessary to post) at the AB Forum, or just email me like everyone else does. I don’t have a problem with that. adventurebooksofseattle AT Gmail.
Want to know HOW the film production company intends to present the story on Kenny Chistiansen?
See this: https://thedbcooperhijacking.wordpress.com/2017/02/02/d-b-cooper-book-on-ken-christiansen-optioned-for-feature-film/
I’m not sure what you want from me in regards to the DBC forum. It isn’t my place to speak about the behavior of anyone there. Shutter has been nothing but gracious to the members there as far as I can tell. I’ve never spoken to Bryan Woodruff so his relationship with you, and with the DBC Forum, is not anything that I can speak to. As far as going to the Unsolved Crimes forum and posting there, not gonna happen.
I also noticed what you did with this comment: “Look, you can believe what you wish regarding Kenny and Bernie. Not everyone thinks they are guilty. Many do, some don’t.”
But, you actually got it backwards. It should be “Some do, most do not”.
You really shouldn’t speak for the public regarding their opinion on Kenny’s guilt or innocence. Because I haven’t seen any actual polls done on that except for the tiny one done at the DBC Forum. That was frankly laughable. No one votes for Kenny (expected, yes) but eight people voted for Rackstraw…a guy with either green or blue eyes and twenty years younger than the descriptions. And I don’t care if you post to the Guest Thread or not. I merely suggested that if you had comments, it might be better than using Bruce’s news site to make your comments.
I could point you to a few hints that perhaps the public is leaning KC’s way as far as his guilt. The many supporting emails I receive, and the phone calls for example. Or the fact that the video on KC has now reached 50,000 views with about 158 upvotes compared to 20 downvotes. I suspect most of the downs came from members of the Cooper Forum, which is expected.
The fact that a film production company in LA investigated KC for more than a year before deciding to invest in the first SERIOUS feature film on Cooper…and name Kenny and Bernie as the perps, and not leave moviegoers hanging at the end. They plan to present it as historical fact.
You have a lot of comments about me, or Kenny Christiansen’s possible guilt, but not a peep from you in defense of the place where you hang out most regarding DB Cooper. And I call that one-sided and phony. I can tell you guys over there are either deliberately ignoring the latest updates on what we know and what we don’t…or you’re still living in the past. I can’t figure out which, but it reminds me of the ‘obtuse’ scene from the film, ‘The Shawshank Redemption’. I’m constantly amazed on how you keep living on non-updated information regarding Kenny and Company over there.
Some people in the media think the site is a joke. More now than previously, when you were taken more seriously. They come to us…see the open site, the downloads, the down-to-earth posts. Then they drop by the DBC and see all links and pictures are hidden from the public, and a ‘Suspects’ page that is nothing but silly. Even when people try to give you the straight scoop, the latest information, etc you stick your heads into the ground and say, “Na Na Na Na…I can’t HEAR you…” And that is funny. Problem is, only YOU guys do that, not the public, not visitors to the site. I even offered you guys a chance to participate in the making of the film, but no one answered. The film execs told me I was wasting my time with the DBC Forum, and they recognized how silly and slanted it was from the start. I guess they were right. Your belief that the DBC Forum is King of Cooperland has been shattered. Your thought that you could shut out both the public AND the truth by bad-mouthing me over there more than a thousand times did not work. In fact, it helped make people curious as to why you would come after us that hard, as if we were some kind of threat to your closed-captioned New Cooper Order.
That stuff never works. Especially when I run a place where we will give it to people straight. This is the real deal, Parrot:
People go to the DBC Forum when they want to be entertained. They come to us for the truth, and a non-biased look at things. Eventually, it gets results.
“The fact that a film production company in LA investigated KC for more than a year before deciding to invest in the first SERIOUS feature film on Cooper…and name Kenny and Bernie as the perps, and not leave moviegoers hanging at the end. They plan to present it as historical fact.”
Presenting it as historical fact, does not make it historical fact. The number of views and upvotes on youtube mean nothing. I saw a LD Cooper video with 490 upvotes? Does that make him Cooper? And why does every single thing I post result in you going on a rant about the DBC Forum? You’re obviously butt hurt over not being included. Lots of butt hurt in the world today.
Well, perhaps some people are more convinced than you think. I did try to caveat them, as I tell everyone: I cannot be 100% sure. But with all the new evidence that keeps coming to light, they felt I was being too conservative about the situation. As far as the Cooper Forum, you must be joking. I wouldn’t go near that place with a single post if they offered me a gold-plated invitation. If I were actually associated with that place on the internet, I wouldn’t be where I am today. In fact, it was their ridiculous negativity, the constant name-calling, and the actual construction of the site that served as a major factor in bringing more attention to the truth about Christiansen.
One thing’s for sure. A film like that is going to determine the truth of the matter on Christiansen in very short order. And that is the think most desired by me…and most feared by the haters you hang with right now.
Correction: “THING.” There is one other item here. In all of this journey down Cooper Road, I have to give it to Bruce Smith. Aside from using a few cute nicknames for me, he has never played dirty tricks on me, or Gayla, or any of the AB staff. He has made his own choices here and there regarding his participation on certain things with me. But he never stooped to doing things like Georger and Shutter have been known to do. And for that I give him a certain amount of respect.
” No one votes for Kenny (expected, yes) but eight people voted for Rackstraw…a guy with either green or blue eyes and twenty years younger than the descriptions.”
– Said the the guy who pushes a different suspect, who is farther off of the description than Rackstraw.
I don’t have to ‘push’ Kenny as a suspect in the case. The evidence is definitely there against both he and Bernie Geestman. In fact, when the film guys did the first conference call with me I was careful to point out that I could not prove (yet) that these two were guilty beyond a reasonable doubt.
None of you over there at the DBC Forum (with a few exceptions) are dealing in reality. The name calling and the attacks that have been going on both in public, and secretely under different usernames for years. These actions are an indicator of FEAR, not hostility against me personally. And that’s because none of you, with the exception of Bruce Smith, have met me. You have no clue what I’m actually like in real life except for what you’ve read.
Let’s face it. Who are you trying to convince that there is no evidence? Me? Yourselves? The first is useless, since i know what we have on these guys and its more than you probably know, but you do know the basics. Yourselves? If you were already convinced, you wouldn’t spend so much time, effort, and postings in denial. Again, it shows FEAR. You would simply laugh, ignore me, and move on. But you can’t do that. Why? Again, FEAR.
If you truly believed there is nothing to the evidence, and didn’t worry that we might be right, you
wouldn’t waste your time. But the fact is you and others spend a great deal of time doing those things I mentioned. The problem is…if you invest so much negativity in something like that, it makes it extremely difficult to just back away and let the chips fall where they will. And this entire argument is pointless anyway. The truth is, sooner or later it’s going to come out one way or another on these two guys. Did they or didn’t they do it? You don’t know which way it will go any more than I do, not for certain. To say you do, or to claim with certainty that you’re right about KC and Geestman makes no more sense than if I say they were FOR SURE involved. It’s a waste of time on both sides. You’re even trying to speak for the public now, and I have responded to that already.
Face it. You and some of your friends pulled out all the stops, tried every dirty trick in the book, tried names, and whatever else. But you couldn’t rid yourselves of either me, or the current evidence against Kenny Christiansen, no matter what you tried. In fact, your overly negative approach just sent more attention my way. Now we are at the point where perhaps the first serious feature film is going to be produced on the Cooper case…starring Kenny and Bernie in the title roles. Must be driving you guys crazy. And I have no sympathy for you and yours at all. You make your bed, you must also lie in it. You even made decisions that excluded you (the supposed ‘experts’ on the Cooper case) from any participation in it, after I was the most fair to all of you by trying to include you in that process. You made those decisions on your own, and you must live with them.
I wanted to add a caveat here. By ‘you’ I did not mean YOU personally Parrot. You and Bruce Smith have been reasonably fair, considering. I meant some of the people who hang with you at the Cooper forum. You do understand that sometimes people can be judged by the company they keep, even if they don’t participate in some of the ugliness that goes on with that company…
You raise a good point here. Why argue with you? Do I expect to change your mind? No, not at all. But there are others who read this stuff and I believe that your “evidence” needs to be challenged. I have friends that know that I follow the Cooper case, but yet none of them are that interested in it. I guarantee you that I could convince any of them that Kenny Christiansen was Cooper. I could also convince them that it was LD, Weber or Peterson. It’s easy. When people don’t have a lot of knowledge of the case, it’s easy for them to look at the circumstantial evidence around any suspect and come to the conclusion that the suspect must be guilty. That’s the problem with people that push suspects. They want to tell us why their suspect is the guy, but they obviously don’t want to talk about the arguments against their guy. You say that you can’t prove that Kenny was Cooper, but then you get defensive as hell when someone challenges you on some your arguments. One needs to only look at the reviews to your book at Amazon to see that you don’t react to well to people not agreeing with your assessment on Kenny. The evidence against KC just isn’t that strong. Lots of blind assumptions and wild guesses. Kenny isn’t here to defend himself, but yet Bernie is. But his family don’t want to speak against him until he dies, so that he won’t be able to defend himself. They think he’s guilty, but “Let’s wait until he dies to tell the world how guilty he is”. That’s bullshit.
Well, if you want to challenge the evidence against Kenny, why don’t you do what others have done? Check the FBI report I released publicly. Not just read it. Do your own checking on it. It’s got names, addresses, and some emails when available. I have nothing to hide. See if it’s valid if you wish. Almost everything is there, you know. It’s not my job to force people to come forward on their own regarding their own family member, i.e. Geestman. Sure, I’ve done an interview or two with them, and some things I found out I haven’t released. It’s a delicate situation and if I just blabbed everything out there to people, they would never tell me another thing. It’s the truth I seek, not booksales at Amazon, or backslapping reviews there. Most of the bad reviews have dates that PRECEED the actual publication of the book. That means they based their reviews on the very incomplete first version, which only sold a few copies anyway. Or I gave them a copy of the early PDF from 2009, which was before Decoded or Bernie’s lies on the show. The later reviews are mostly good. Amazon accounts for less than five percent of AB’s total booksales. We’re a WHOLESALE publisher, releasing at the trade rate through Ingram. Most sales come from other booksellers, bookstores, and the like.
Bruce’s news site isn’t the place to discuss anything regarding Cooper, not really. Not unless they have to do with the subject of a particular article he writes. You can’t edit your posts here and you can’t present pictures or documents, so what’s the point? I know you and other members of the Cooper forum visit the AB Forum site because I’ve kept track of your IP’s. One way I verified them was to temporarily ban some of you one at a time and wait for Shutter to complain about it. Or I had Greg the Techie Guy do some checking for me. None of you are currently banned, by the way. Just a few spammers. I even opened up a Guest Thread for visitors. You could post your questions there if you wish. They will be seen by others, I assure you. We average about sixty guest visits a day, and around 4-8K page views per month. We’re also picking up members here and there, three just this week. I’d come to your place, but the door’s locked. (*smiles*)
The reason I don’t cooperate with you guys anymore is because some of you took the dirty tricks too far, or told outright lies, and I decided I wouldn’t trust any of you anymore. Gayla told me I was nuts for even offering members of the Cooper Forum imput and active participation in the first real Cooper film. She reminded me of a few things. Whether you and yours are right or wrong about KC isn’t the whole point here. The point is that some of you took your actions to another level and I made a very comprehensive post at the AB Forum. (“Our Response to Negativity at…’) I do give it to people straight. I have a reputation for that that goes back far before I got roped into Cooperland.
Sometimes it’s difficult to swallow how much outright hatred comes from some of the people you hang with over at the DBC. Trashing our efforts with the Ariel Store, allowing Galen Cook to spout a bunch of lies about being in contact with Skipp Porteous, etc. Those posts are still there, by the way. He’s a frickin’ officer of the court and should know better. I hold Shutter and Georger at least partially responsible if the Ariel Store doesn’t reopen, because our view is that ‘The Biggest Website on DB Cooper’ should have looked beyond their personal issues with us and stood WITH Adventure Books in our efforts to help the store. Instead, I read stuff like ‘we’d help if it wasn’t for Blevins,’ and nasty comments that were still coming through the very day before the party, when Travel Channel showed up. You should look at Bryan’s Facebook page for the store now. The one I created for him was getting tons of traffic. His new one, hardly any. I made good videos in support of the store, one where I held up a sign with Bryan’s address telling people where to send their money. Now they’re all gone. We were getting a lot of public attention focused on him and his plight, and now that’s gone too. A few of the locals who worked with us told me privately they didn’t understand why he turned his back on us for no good reason, and so they did the same to Bryan. I’m sure he still has supporters there, but it’s not exactly a rich community around there. He needed outside help for sure.
He may still reopen, but it’s going to be difficult for him. I was excited to be able to draw from the trust fund and just give him the damn money. I figured…it’s the one thing I can do in Cooperland before I move away from Washington that will be remembered. Bryan doesn’t even have a regular job, and can’t borrow the money. I’ve seen the place from top to bottom. Without a huge influx of cash, it will never reopen as a tavern and a store. It’s frickin’ sad is what it is, and your friends were a ‘partial’ cause of all that. Not totally, but they have to shoulder some of the blame, especially when Shutter was saying his website, his people, could handle the job better than we could. Look what happened. All this infighting has not hurt me in the slightest. In fact, I may have benefited in some ways. The only time I got angry was when Shutter sacrificed our efforts with the store simply because he doesn’t like me. That was cruel. Not to me, but to Bryan. He already had enough problems going already, with some of his family members wanting to sell off the Cooper memorabilia or move it elsewhere piecemeal. We were on a roll with him and ready to move to the next level. Now the store is probably doomed, and Gayla won’t even let me mention its name to her anymore.
I sent an email to Bruce Smith. I told him: Maybe it’s time to restict comments to the article at hand and not use this place as a forum. Or something to that effect.
“I was excited to be able to draw from the trust fund and just give him the damn money. I figured…it’s the one thing I can do in Cooperland before I move away from Washington that will be remembered…”
There would have been only ONE condition. Bryan would set up the contractors and get their bids. And I would meet with them together with Bryan and we would all discuss it. THEN I would write the checks. Seemed reasonable. If the bid was solid, and the work would result in success, then okay, I was willing to do it. I don’t have a lot personally compared to other people, but my folks don’t have to worry where their next meal is coming from, if you get my drift. It was a big opportunity for Bryan, and something I wanted to do. Bryan and his girlfriend Tina Strong were very nice to me at the party. When I left, I got hugs and thanks. Three days later he crapped on us for no reason that I think was justified. Our actions with him were above board and generous, while the Cooper Forum busied themselves trashing the whole thing…simply because they couldn’t stand it we were involved. The only victim was the store.
Why do you continue to do this? No matter what I say, or what I ask, your response always goes back to the Cooper Forum and “the people I hang out with”. Just so you know, it’s a message board…an internet forum. There are probably millions of them. I don’t “hang out” with anyone there, though there are some folks that post there that I would like to meet. I’ve never met Bryan at the Ariel store and I don’t need to read the story of what happened there for the 20th time. I’ve never met Shutter, but he’s always fair to everyone there and he does a damn good job on the forum. No one complains about him, other than you. So please, if you are going to respond to something I post, quit repeating the same shit over and over and over and over and over.
And over and over and over.
And over.
Look, I think I did answer your questions as well as I could. And I gave you more time and written responses than most people get. And besides, I wasn’t talking about how Shutter treats you guys over there. I was talking about the things he has done that have hurt certain elements in Cooperland, and how a site that touts itself as the biggest on Cooper isn’t really reaching the public much at all.
You’re right. There is no use going on about all this. I answered your questions, and I made my case pretty clear. If you have any more questions, you know where you can find me. I think we should stop using Bruce’s news site as a message board. One thing is without a doubt. Certain folks, and that includes you in this one, will never see eye-to-eye on a few issues, and that’s just the way it is.
Editor’s Note: I’m tired of dealing with you two bickering on the Mountain News-WA. Please know that all other posts from you will be deleted.
– BAS
My apologies Bruce. I should have walked away from this one long ago.
Well – I guess it is time to put some things into perspective and I hope that Parrrothead Vol will be able to come here and help me out….
Modulus in 1969 and 1970 and other yrs made parts not only for Boeing – they made parts for RACE CARS….
Duane Weber took me to 2 outings with friends he knew in RACE car circuit and he was a PERSONAL friend of one of the racers’ father….a man Duane admired very much…& spoke of him very sadly. He was a brother image & a mentor image for Duane – but Duane screwed up again only this time he DID not get caught…..I believe the man knew what Duane had done, but I cannot share that reasoning since it is just my own feelings _ not something I actually know for a fact.
Duane met this person while he was in the hospital in GA and told that his kidneys were failing…& would need dialysis in the next few yrs……but dialysis started to advance & Duane when he got bad the last 5 yrs of his life was on the Kidney Machine 1990 to 1995…but it is even BETTER now…technology is keeping individuals alive & transplants are saving lives . Transplants where in their infancy when Duane went to be evaluated…and Duane saw the CHILDREN waiting for a rare kidney transplant & told the facility he had led a full life. Duane loved children and mentor many who were going in the wrong direction…he was diverting them from leading the life of thief as he had become.
I guess I need to stay on topic – I cannot at this time reveal who the man was – but he was man who Duane respected & love like a brother or a father…I had been looking for this man for YRS., but did not find him until he died…(if I spelled out the details it could cause emotional trauma for those he left behind). I will not do that until I talk to them – “all of them”…I am in the process of trying to connect with the living relatives of this man at this time…but have little to go on so if there is a PI out there willing to work for ZERO – contact me – you need to live in the S.E. and most of the research will focus on Georgia and the RACING industry in that area in the late 60’s and early 70’s…odd that SLUGGO was friends with some of these guys. I now realize Sluggo was feeling me out to see how much I really knew…..that WAS his only REASON for the 3 days he spent in my home…I do not know if SLUGGO is still alive…
I do know SLUGGO was fishing when he was here – and his reason for bringing up the RACING industry…I didn’t think to tell him about Duane making a special trip to see a man in that field & another time when he went to the area the man lived in ( a state NOT too far away) & mailed him a package from the local post office – just dropped it in the slot at the post office. He didn’t want to go see the man – but wanted him to have whatever was in that package…he admired this man very much…now I know why!
The man was an engineer & well respected in AVIATION and RACING…but I will not spell out the specifics…..What kind of Engineer or What Kind of RACING…I just know he was a great mentor for DUANE and set him on his way to success or it could be that Duane used this man’s knowledge & why he could not be seen by him…Since they are both deceased – I can only speculate unless there is a family member still living that might be able to fill in the empty spaces…and I think there is.
Do any of you know who made the equipment for the RACE cars” Modulus made the equipment for the RACE CARS…. (Duane Weber was the one who SOLD the products to the Racing Industry). He also sold a line of NUTS and BOLTS made by another industry to install the Race car EQUIPMENT! Parts for Race CARS in 1970 where manufactured in the same plant as the parts for BOEING and for the SPACE SHIPS that went to the MOON. How Duane happen to know one of the ASTRONAUTS. Duane was at times in the plants and he helped to install some of the equipment on the race cars.
Some of the individuals who think they know so much about TI & the other things found on the TIE need to stop & THINK! EVERYONE of those items – DUANE WEBER had contact with In 1969 and 1970 and maybe in 1968, but for some reason that FILE is missing…WHY did Duane keep these OLD returns 8 yrs – in his CAR locked in a metal box? The FBI made copies of them – and NOW they need to go BACK & take another look at what they missed….
Duane had the know how, the knowledge and the accessibility between his connections to Modulus & Boeing & the company who made the paint for BOEING…Remember Duane’s brother played a part in the DEVELOPMENT of the BOEING as did his brothers best friend Stanley Gillliam who married the God child of Duane’s mother’s best friend. Duane actually grew up in this environment…he could never live up to what the family expected from him.
WHY the sister was removed from CA! – I will never forget her frantic last phone call to me before her son picked her up to take her to his home. I wrote the names down – sound alikes because I was having a difficult time following her and she was FRANTIC and I didn’t want her to have a heart attack on the phone…it was one of the RARE times she CALLED me…and after her son took her she did manage to send a couple of short letters off – but, she kept the communication VERY neutral…they had no return address and only a stamp mark…SHE did NOT want to go live with him.
Yrs later I would by accident decipher the names…..I had been led to believe I was looking for the WEBER name – but it was his mothers MAIDEN name I should have chased – but they used a name in her obit that was not her middle name unless she had two middle names or a prior marriage…..I was not able to find the heritage until a correction was made on Duane’s MOTHER”S death notice…yrs later…about 2yrs ago…when the pieces started to come together.
IF anyone wants to help me – contact me thru my email address and not on this site. I will try to answer questions but I cannot and will not give out names – until I get some help from a PI or the government (no charges)….if I am right – this case is solve – well, actually it was solve when I first contacted the FBI and if they had done their job – a lot of money could have been saved and 100’s if not 1000’s of individuals would not have used up their lives chasing a crime because the FBI refused or was ordered not to pursue.
Race Cars used Modulous products – and Duane was very active in those yrs in the RACE car industry…When he and I met he took me and my daughter to a couple of events …I had NO idea that MODULOUS in those yrs maked equipment for RACE CARS…
Individuals like so many other who are promoting a subject – fabricate information.
Something I have refused to do.
THe MODULUS who made equipment for the 727’s and the Moon craft – also made products for the RACING world…The Modulus of those days in no longer and I need to find their old records…someone who worked with them that can substanciate what they made and that indeed one of the Astronauts did visit the Factories or spoke at a conventions or meeting…
The very thing that Robert JUMPED on is what othersoften do – not looking at the yrs and the history.—– but, I tired to tell about this yrs ago until I fell into a WELL of information.
Almost every chemical the investigators used where made and / or used in the products Modulous produced….Duane’s friends were race car people and builders of the vehicles.
He said a couple of things back then that I didn’t GET – I knew ZERO about race cars and the drivers…but he knew them ALL. Someone at one time sent me a copy of a race and in one of the vehicles was a “picture” of WEBER…I took it as a JOKE – but wh ever did that – several computer crashes ago – was sending me a message I didn’t “get”.
I recently located a man I have looked high & low for but didn’t know his name – until I pulled up his occupation a few days ago and there was HIS OBIT – now in the process of trying to find his family… Duane had spoke fondly of the man many timed and even went to the town he lived in and dropped a package in the mail – I asked why he wasn’t going to see him – he said he wouldn’t be home – it was SUNDAY! NOW I Know what that man is and how Duane met him – but absolutely no verification until I reach one of his sons or his daughter…a man who worked in an industry involved in the event of the DAYS. Really afraid to say too much less someone stop me from finishing my mission.
That industry Duane supplied the parts – made by the MODULUS CORP of those days.
HE became friends of several men in this industry and attended events the industry had.
It was a subject I never dreamt would be connected to the space ship industry in any way what so ever…I hope you know who leaves me alone so I can finish my project and I really need help for older guy in that industry but do not know how to approach them or find them…but I certainly won’t put it in a public forum so that people can hassel this family or accuse them of things….I think some of them knew after the fact or suspected it, but because of one man – who mentored Duane no one spoke up about their suspicions.
I admire the man I am speaking of and do NOT believe he had anything to do with the SKYJACKING – but I do believe he knew AFTER the fact or he took a good guess at it.
Perhaps he did NOT know the real truth until he recieved a package – I just remember we were living in AL or FL and it was AFTER Duane started on the kidney machine in 1990 – at least that sounds logical. I really thought it odd we drove so far for him to put a package in the mail to the man home town of the day. NOW I know who that man was and what he did – but it did NOT come out until I located the MODULUS Corp – and all of sudden he is every where and knew Duane had spoke of him many times.
Remember that Weber had the knowledge of an unusual and unique communications program – from his time in the service and as a unknown from 1964 to 1968 (approximately)…I know this occurred after 1962 and before 1968…as best as I can judge. The man in the skiing industry I believe they all served – about the same time…inthe 50’s and had connections in the 60’s – all about the same age..I will never have all the pieces of the puzzle, but there will be enough and after knowing Duane and the things he told me over the yrs…he was indeed DAN COOPER.
Yes – Duane did know Kenny and he knew the other man who seemingly does not want to talk – hopefully if he is still alive he will contact me – but I expect he is deceased. The PI – he also was a catalylist to get the story told…I was in contact with that man before what’s his face was..only by computer and he claimed to be a private eye…I finally found those old thing I printed from his first attempt at a site regarding his being a PI, but he did NOT ID himself as a PI in the beginning – he came in about the things I remembered seeing on the highway between Portland and WA and putting the places and the signs in prospective…It was at that time he knew that the man I was married to was the man he was looking for…but he had to let go – he needed someone he could manuever – perhaps he was needing money or just wanted to get some of the truths out there..
Jo, You have lost your mind. First, Duane was never Cooper. I’ve watched for years as you’ve played six degrees of Duane Weber. “Duane saw the CHILDREN waiting for a rare kidney transplant & told the facility he had led a full life.”. Sorry Jo, but that is NOT how transplants work. Duane didn’t turn down a kidney so a child could have one. They would’ve had the children on the list before Duane. The Doctors have enough sense to decide if the kidney should go to a elderly man or a child, so stop acting like Duane was a Saint. And as for this-“Duane was at times in the plants and he helped to install some of the equipment on the race cars.” That is a flat out lie. The mechanics place the parts on race cars, not the employees of the business. Duane was never a race car mechanic! And I don’t even understand why your trying to tie Sluggo into this. I guess because Sluggo liked racing. Guess what? There are tons of people who like NASCAR, Sluggo happened to be one of millions who like NASCAR. I’m sorry but I don’t see what Duane supposedly working for a company that makes parts for “space ships” has to do with anything, but I’m not surprised, as you’ve been trying to prove Duane was Cooper for years. Stop with the nonsense and lies. Let me guess, was Duane’s friend the race car driver named Dale Earnhardt?
Bruce THANK you for leaving those 2 posts…it is all over now. God Bless all who have stayed with me on this 20 yr journey…respectfully – Jo Weber widow of Duane Weber.
Confirmed – Modulus did sell equipment to the Racers in FL and Duane was the salesman.
He also became relatively Close to many of the individuals – racers and their families. The equipment he sold did contain most of the elements they found on the Tie.
The race cars required equipment that could take HIGH temps and also items that were FLEXIBLE but, also very strong…You guys better look up what was used and study the RACE car industry of 1960’s….The Modulus Company of those days no longer exists…other companies used that name.
Someone is going to look up some photos and send them to me – photos taken in 1967 – 1970…but like myself are elderly (older) and going thru boxes of photos is exhausting…and they like myself threw away photos we had NO reason to keep – simply because we couldn’t remember when the photo was taken and who the individuals where…we had written nothing on the backs to trigger a memory…we just put them in a box…and those that meant something to us might or might not have gotten put in an album and/r put in a box (one we never got around to putting into albums) our children visit and they take photos home with them…
I need an ANGEL on my shoulder right now and all of the prayers you guy can throw my way.
Duane Lorin Weber was released from the Canon City CO prison in 1962. The out take photo is very different from the intake photo in 1960, but he is tanned and has a smile on his face. I no longer have the ability to put the photos up. The description on the file reads:
Height 6
Weight 190
Complexion – Medium Ruddy
Eyes Brown
Date 5-3-62
CSP 32755
The tie was a narrow black – a very standard part of the uniform for bartenders, waiters, food servers, bus boys, and sales. It was during the early 70’s that the ties became wider, but many sales persons such as debit salesmen continued to use the narrow clips because of convenience.
In Atlanta, Georgia – most of the major upscale restaurants required the narrow tie with a tie clip or tac as the uniform of choice for the food servers and others. (Perhaps so they were easy to spot and not mistaken for a patron) – The Midnight Sun which is a restuarant in Atlanta in the 70’s required this of its personnel. I do not know if Duane worked there under the name of John C. Collins or Duane Lorin Weber. He did sales and then at night worked at the club.
Tax return for 1969 — shows he worked at the Bourbon Orleans Hotel in New Orleans, La. & Mobil Teria Catering Co. in Kansas City, Mo, & the Annbar Associate Hotel Muehebach in Kansas, MO & the Thirteenth and Baltimor Corp in Kansas.
Also during those yrs he worked at the Cherokee Town & Country Club, Inc in Atlanta, GA & Burke Concrete Accessories, Inc Burlingame, CA. & Modulus Corp of Cleveland, OH, and one insurance company working from Columbia, SC. for 2 or 3 months…he was in association with Skyjumpers at that time.
Tax return for 1971 — basically little to NO income..and yet put a lot of mileage on his car…that is because he traveled to WA. and wrote it off as business. Income was basically nothing to mention.
But somehow managed to purchase 2 cars in early 1972.
.His wife of the era admitted that she dyed his hair at one time. Early 1971 – Lots of medical expenses and a new car….How the hell did he pay for that.
His military History:
What I cannot understand is that he is kicked out of the Navy and then turns up in the Army. The records are accurate and legal documentations for each.
FYI: I am currently working with a member of the ‘Brad Meltzer’s Decoded’ cast on their article regarding the hijacking for the Smithsonian Magazine. Three guesses allowed on who they are naming as the hijacker, but you’ll only need one.
Look folks, I just follow the truth wherever it goes. People are starting to come forward. I cannot help that, and try to qualify their information as best I can. It was bound to happen. I can’t wait for my vacation to the mountains on March 17. Trust me on this. (*smiles*)
Belvins I am sure YOU have not told them the lastest development – it would burst your bubble.
In fact the NEW evidence is very compelling – it is overwhelming..
I have been in the hospital and I have a serious injury to my hand and arm…typing this is very painful…so what I do will be limited – but there are those who are marching forward with the infomation I provided.
Jo Weber: Sometimes people compare me to you. But the reality is I am NOTHING like you. That’s because I deal in reality. I have pretty much set aside Cooper for this year, except for the work I have agreed to do for the production company. Sure, I will do that for them. But otherwise, it’s all about our plan to see the upcoming eclipse in August, and have fun all summer before we do.
http://unsolved-crimes.freeforums.net/board/125/public-event-solar-eclipse-camping
There has been much confusion and discord regarding the upcoming first full-length dramatic feature film on the Cooper case. Posts here, there, and everywhere, as the Beatles would say. I recently answered an email inquiry about all that (came from a member of the DB Cooper Forum) with this:
“I saw Georger’s whining post over at the Cooper Forum yesterday. So many lies are floating around over there it’s hard to know where to begin. Rather than listing the lies, I will just state a few facts for the record.
The film producers I am working with now visited the Cooper Forum before they came to me. Their main complaint was that unless you register through Shutter first, you can’t see any links or pictures anyone tries to present there anyway. They were also put off by all the negative comments about yours truly. They don’t want anything to do with anyone who is there now.
After I signed the OPA on the book (‘Option to Purchase Agreement’) and the KC files with the producers, they said they would be willing to sign Cooper Forum user ‘Andrade’ and Bruce Smith to co-producer agreements, mainly because they both have Cooper books out there that are fairly recent. The offer was: $15,000 to each of them, should the picture be made, payable on the first day of production shooting. Also, a co-producer credit for each of them in the picture. Bruce didn’t believe me, and Andrade never got the word because Shutter refused my request to notify members of his forum that a film was in the works. For this payment and credit, Smith and Andrade were going to be asked to examine the script for accuracy, especially on details related to the hijacking itself, and be willing to answer questions about the hijacking with the producers, via phone, email, and Skype. There was no catch. The producers asked me to approach them about it, because they did not want the name of the company put out on the internet or discussed before plans on the picture were finalized. I had to agree to confidentiality as well, when I signed the OPA. They wanted me to ‘feel them out’ about possible participation in the picture. After all the crap postings on this subject at the Cooper Forum, mostly by Smith, ‘Georger’, and Cooper Forum admin ‘Shutter’, one of the producers emailed me about it. They had SEEN these comments. He said: “We’re better off without them.”
I still made one more approach by email to Smith. He never even bothered to answer. As far as Martin Andrade, I feel sorry for him. Shutter should have told him what was going on. I sent a message to Shutter using a different email, and I could tell from his response that he read it, because he told me it wasn’t his job to ‘promote’ some film I was working on. All he really did was screw Andrade. Just like he did with Bryan Woodruff and the Ariel Store. It’s not MY fault that there is so much BS and hatred being spewed by he and Georger over there that some media types are blowing them off now. That is HIS fault.
Producers told me three days ago that now that we have the Christiansen family’s exclusive release, the picture will almost certainly be made. They met with several film companies last week, and more are scheduled for this coming week. They want to bring at least one other company on board to make the picture. And this picture WILL be made, I assure you.
Gayla Prociv, the CEO of Adventure Books of Seattle, says if she ever met Georger in person, she would slap his face. Just saying.
Sincerely, Robert” (some portions of the previous email were redacted for privacy)
(To Bruce: Make sure you delete this comment so that people won’t find out the truth. You passed up on one of the best deals ever offered in the Cooper case, and missed out on your chance for a nice payday and a credit in the picture. All your OWN doing. I have absolutely no sympathy for you.)
Well, I see after some days that my comment is still here. I will give you respect for that decision. I just can’t figure out why you decided to say ‘pass’ on the offer regarding the first-ever dramatic feature film on the Cooper hijacking? It’s a mystery to me. And before you point to me as the reason, remember you would not have been working with ME, nor would I be the one writing the check on the first day of production filming. I will recognize that you have principles, and that somehow the picture itself somehow offended those principles. For that, you get my respect at least.
Bruce, does the FBI have DNA or not? They demand money or the parachute, yet they have ruled out Duane Weber and LD Cooper out because the DNA didn’t match. I’m really confused. To be honest I think they owe Jo and Marla Cooper an apology and they need to reopen the case, and admit that they are lying about ruling those suspects out. Is there any bigger of a joke or less credible agency than the FBI right now? They certainly need to get it together. Letting a paintball guru handle actual Cooper evidence and examine it with a black light and parade around with it on tv. Who on earth does that? I know we all have different suspects that we like and are dead set on believing is Cooper, but we need to stick together against the way the case has been handled.
Yes, the FBI has DNA samples. Three different males, they say. The bigger question is whose DNA is it? No one knows.
As for the paint ball guru, he has done a lot more credible work than you have DG. You need to improve your manners, sir, rather than castigate an accomplished researcher.
Credible work? What has he accomplished? Has he found Cooper? He has theory’s, we all have theory’s. He parades around on tv every time a Cooper episode is on. How on earth does the FBI let him handle evidence? I am very new at this but my gosh something really stinks in the whole thing. 46 years of looking for Cooper and you have been letting a paintball expert and dinosaur bone collector look at major evidence? Come on Bruce your smart enough to see a mess when there is a mess. Telling family of suspects that you cleared there family member by DNA when you don’t really have DNA or a good enough sample to eliminate or confirm a suspect. The definition of insanity is doing the same things over and over and expecting a different result. I have read all of you guys post on the forums, you guys are so smart and yal have forgot more than I will ever know about the Cooper case but I’m telling you sir the way this whole thing was investigated and handled and letting Tom Kaye get his blacklight out and look at the Cooper tie, looks like something off the 3 stooges. If the Cooper case is ever going to be closed its Time to start running a different play. The one the Cooperites and FBI ran the last 46 years obviously didn’t work. Something is coming that will solve this case in about 4 minutes and I want one of us to solve it before then.
He found the titanium. ‘Nough said?
Plus the pollen spores, bismuth, and rare earth metals. Who else can match that? And you bad mouth him? Shame on you, sir.
Bruce I believe that when the money was found in February of 1980 and Tena joining the Carmelites a few weeks later was no coincidence. I think the FBI even thought it was a plant and scared the crap out of them and Tena. For 9 years they all thought he died, then he reminded Tina and the world that he was still alive at “Tena Bar” of all places. Then there she went into hiding and nobody could figure out how it got there. We use to shred newspapers and put them in garbage bags and go rolling the yards of people we didn’t like. After throwing toilet paper everywhere we would throw the shreds all over the yards so they would have quite a mess to pick up. When the bag was empty we would take the garbage bag and turn it inside out and just make sure we got everything out of it in to one little pile, couldn’t Cooper have had the money in a little bag and took it out and placed it in a hole and then turned the bag over to get any shreds of the money out and that explain how the shreds were found under the 3 bundles. Over time they would have sank quicker with rain and flooding because they weren’t bundled together? Lol. Then again what do I know I’m not a paintball guru such as Tom Kaye. If I would have watched more of the land before time I would have been a better dinosaur fossil finder when I was little
A couple of things:
First, Tina was already “in hiding” by the time time the money was found at T-Bar. She was convalescing in the medical facility in Gresham and had been there for some time. How long is unknown. Or you could say she was in hiding when she moved to San Diego and lived with her sister.
Secondly, please stop with the disparagement of Tom Kaye. His findings in the Cooper case are singular, substantive, and worthy of respect. If you disagree with any of his findings or analysis, then say so and tell us why.
Duane Weber’s brother lived in Wa and worked for BOEING and RETIRED from Boeing…..see a link to the tie and Boeing. The woman who married Stanley Gilliam who also worked for Boeing was Duane’s Brothers best friend and Stanley married the daughter of Duane’s Mothers best friend.
The wife of Stanley Gilliam was Connected to Duane and his Brother and to the family. The met in California.
The tie is NOT rocket science – it is connections and more connections and connections that I can prove to BOEING….but, NO one wants the truth…THE FBI can check the above information and find that every word in this post is correct.
I just GAVE you those 4 m,inutes to solve the case – I did yrs ago.
Bruce you need to contact me – want old addresses for John Collins and Stanley Gilliam and the location in CA where they met and they joined the service together and the Stanley married the love of his life – who just happen to be the daughter of Duane’s Mother’s best friend….I have long walked away trying to get the truth known – and by HELL, I came over here tonight to see what was going on – and LO and BEHOLD there it was – CASE SOLVED.
Also note that Duane took me to Tena’s bar in 1979 on our trip to Seattle & he told me about a woman who worked in a center in Oregon – that is were TINA was at that time and after the money was found – she panicked…not because of the money but perhaps someone entered her living quarters & left her a little gift, but taking something in exchange such as the Cook Book he took when he was on the plane or her Mouse…it was his way of letting her know he survived and that is why she went into a panic in 1979. The MOUSE has many stories to tell….Duane was also called MOUSE as a kid and he had his ears tucked at one time – but the little flap did not last very long – now they use cartilage. I was told by one of the stewardesses that Tina was often referred to as MOUSE….not sure why, but this statement came from Alice (the other stewardess) in a phone conversation I had with her several yrs ago.
Sorry I meant to state John Weber in the prior post and not John Collins – I am getting too old and I am too sick to continue with the case…just letting this site – know and re-interate what have told the FBI in the past – only to be ignored – WHY? IF you guys haven’t figured it out now – YOU Will NEVER KNOW…the song Duane sang on stage to me in Colorado on our wedding night….he performed like a pro. with a full orchester.
Well, it seems like i have been banned from READING the Cooper site – I never attempted to post there – just to read…but when they stepped into territory I am very aware of and sent private email.
NOTE: you are aways sent copies of those emails I send to everyone else..do they offended you. To be BANNED from reading a forum you do not post to – seems makes the internet and the so called research they do – very bias or being presented only by those who want to control the release of information – so their theories do not go down the tubes. I thought this was AMERICA – FREEDOM OF SPEACH….it was not like I was posting there – I was just reading and when they got on subjects I knew something about – I sent out Private emails…letting them know they were in error with their information and/or it was on target with things I am aware of…my last email must have blown a gasket some place…and the only reason that could be – is that I had the truths and they for some reason do not want those truths to ever be made public….this is AMERICA (well, I thought so). NOT like I was knocking on their door or posting in their thread…if they didn’t want to read what I had to say – all they had to do was NOT read the email…not ban me from READING their site….NOW, I know I longer want to live in AMERICA – it is no America any more…when one is publically no allowed To READ a site…I have never attempted to post there except in the very beginning and knew it was not a place for me…but they cannot handle criticism or the truths.
At least you believe in Freedom of speech – you have not banded me from writing a rare post to your forum and I doubt that you would BAN ME FROM READING YOUR SITE….WHY WOULD ANY ONE BAN A PERSON FROM READING A PUBLIC SITE?
I wouldn’t worry. The DB Cooper Forum Dot Com is well-known for trying to silence any dissenting voices. In fact, they go out of their way to do that. This approach never works. It just makes the public wonder why they would do that, and what their motivation would be. The producers currently putting together the first-ever, full-length, dramatic feature film on the hijacking saw the same thing, and blew them off totally. I tried to intervene and include their members, but that effort was rebuffed. We’ve moved on. I’m good with it.
Colbert and colleagues -cold case team :
1.do you have a picture de Winter show he looks like Rackstraw?
2.Do you have any documents de Winter showing his Signature?
3.Do you have bank statements on De Winter / Rackstraw?
4.Do you have any Document paper trail Dewinter and
Rackstraw being same person and being in airline area ?
5.How can you rely and believe drug dealer and drug usser
Shell that was good friends with Briggs doesn’t drugs affect
your _?
6.What made Linda say the things she did about her brother-
Did she do that because it was ask of her or was it because
she had some past grievance issues against him she did not
say ?
7.What really happened to Philip Rackstraw,He had guns
all over the place and he was a alcoholic claim by Linda?
8.Who is Bob Rackstraw real father if it isnt Philip?
9.Pamela King being married few times why did she devorce other
guys & she must of bad mouth the other husbands too?
10.Linda S McGnuiry cheat on her husband _ and left him for Bob,
Here is a woman that bad mouths bob and her ex Charles ?
11.How can Astoria & Cornallis people believe a man like De Winters,
who is ask for money,food , shelter ,that sure don’t prove he is a rich
Swiss man and nobody kept nothing that De winters owned for Dna?
12.motives ,means ,opportunity:without paper trail how can you prove anything -connect -De winters to Robt Rackstraw -just go by -residences astoria/Cornalis since 1971 -memory plays a lot of tricks on person especially whenthey do not have no pictures / proof to back up their stories ?Christensen -has paper trail – does Rackstraw & how about other paratroopers belonging to clubs along oregon and washington state?